1) To feel or express grief or sorrow. See Synonyms at grieve. 2)To show grief for a death by conventional signs, as by wearing black clothes. 3) To make a low, indistinct, mournful sound. Used especially of a dove.
That is the definiton I got my sources from www.dictionary.com for people who don't know what mourn means
And MarMar to answer your 1st question, you know God is loving and caring, and cares about all of us, no matter who it is, and if we are baptized we have the holy spirit! So God want people to be happy than sad!
[quote author=Coptic Servent link=board=1;threadid=2539;start=0#msg39530 date=1127852521] That is the definiton I got my sources from www.dictionary.com for people who don't know what mourn means
No No, I didn't misunderstood, I think you didn't see this part, I guess in this verse it is, but that's only my opinion I would like to see other people's opinion also!
i was told it is ok to mourn but only for a short time. wen someone dies that is. wen someone dies... its human nature to be extremly sad that they are gone making mourning ok. but wen mourning is too much.. it isnt good because they are in Heaven... so there is a limit. For example... mother Theresa... she died and they mourned so much that God allowed her to return to earth where she yelled at those who mourned for returning her to earth from heaven..
this verse I believe is referring to the tears of repentance.. and we know "He who continually goes forth weeping shall doubtless come back rejocing taking his sheaves with him? " Is that the exact verse?
Mikeforjesus is correct; the verse pertains to the mourning that leads to repentance and the ultimate strengthening of one’s spirit. It is a righteous or godly mourning that has a positive effect on the mourner, as he realises, and experiences remorse and sorrow over, the gravity of his sins and the suffering and sins of those around him (see 2 Cor. 12:21, where St Paul mourns over the unrepentant sinners); he consequently undergoes an inner conversion whereby he seeks to better his life and the lives of others. Furthermore, as one's attention is occupied by grief, "they have no fondness for gain or pleasure during the period of their sorrow. They do not aim at glory. They are not provoked by insults nor led captive by envy nor best by any other passion." (St John Chrysostom)
This kind of mourning is to be distinguished from a sinful type of mourning – the mourning which leads to despair (2 Corinthians 7:10)
There is nothing sinful in experiencing the natural human emotion of sadness or depression, upon for example, hearing bad news, or experiencing something negative. It is all about the manner in which you handle and control your emotions, and how you let it affect your outlook on God, others, and yourself, that is the crucial factor.
People can mourn for a departed loved one; but if they start giving up on God - they lose hope in His mercy, they refuse to pray, or go to Church etc.; or they start giving up on others - they reject those who love them, they no longer concern themselves with the needs of others, their life becomes self-centred and focused on their own misery and problems etc.; or they start giving up on themselves - they mope around all day crying, they become lazy and negligent in their responsibilities towards themselves, they refuse to continue achieving and succeeding in their life, they refuse to continue making the most of the gifts God has given them, they refuse to move forward but rather dwell on their depression and allow it to influence the way they act, think, and feel etc.; then, this is most definitely, and without question, a sinful reaction and cultivation of an otherwise perfectly natural human emotion, that may and should be cultivated and used to enhance one's relationship to God and others, and ultimately one's self.
hey guys, sorry for getting in so late but here goes:
"Sorrow is better than laughter, For by a sad countenance, the heart shall be made better"(Ecclesiates 7:3)
I think the term mourining refers to those tears of repentence, and especially the mourning of those people who endure, and carry their crosses silently. I think we can relate this to what's going on in Alexandria right now... Mourning is very blessed because it purifies the heart. It rids it of all pride and jealosy and maliciousness until it finally sees itself as what it actually is--nothing. Through mourning you gain humility because you realize your error and you're clinging to God. When you're crying out to God, be it tears of joy, or of grief, its one of the most powerful prayers because its coming through your heart and God will accept that right away. (as opposed to someone who's just saying words and doesn't feel them) Not only will God accept these prayers but He'll come and hold your hand and wipe away your tears...
"For I, the Lord your God, will hold your right hand, Saying to you, 'Fear not, I will help you.'" (Isaiah 41:13)
Mourning is such a good thing, that the devil gets very envious and frustrated that he tries to make you fall into sin through it. H.H. Pope Shenouda says in Diabolic Wars that despair and sadness are two of the devil's intrigues (methods). He sees you sad and wanting to repent and he will tell you "God will never forgive you, you are filth and he will never accept you" the person then loses hope and falls into despair. In sadness, he might see a person who is repentant and gains humility and the devil will try to turn that humility-the greatest virtue- into sadness. He does this by telling you "you are not worthy to pray, who are you to talk to God?" and for instance he might tell a deacon, "who are you to deserve reading the Holy gospel? you're filthy hands aren't worthy to touch it. and who are you to sing those hymns.. only people worthy to sing should sing them not a filthy person like you"... in doing so the person loses the blessing he would have taken from the gospel, from the hymns...
Anyways, so mourning is an awesome thing just becareful because the devil tries to get you in every way he can.. be like Saint John the Short - he was such a virtuous man that the devils praised him and he would answer them "who am i the poor? have i acheived what saint Anthony and Anba Bemwa have acheived? I am all in sin..." and when they heard this, they would tell him, "You're right, you are filthy.. You are covered in sins, God will never accept you.." and this saint would reply to them by saying "but were are God's mercy and love..?" So then the devils were outraged and told him "You puzzle us, when we lift you up you humble yourself and when you humble you you lift yourself." H.H. Pope Shenouda says that this is how we should respond to the devils' attacks. -Mariam
I think it depends on why you're crying... why? In funerals we're always asking God why and yelling at him, "how can You do this?" and crying... its not wrong to cry over someone that died, what's wrong is to be selfish because that person is with God now; to want them back here on earth is selfishness- i think to cry because you're going to miss that person is natural.. so it's definately not a sin to cry because we're going to miss that person but at the same time we should be happy because that person isn't dead, they're dead to the world and alive in Christ... we're the dead ones, if anything they should be mourning over us.. and pray a lot for that person.. pray A LOT for them.. Our hearts don't want to believe it.. when my friend died last year; it was like some kind of horrible joke- we all didn't want to accept it.. we even went pretty far in our efforts to avoid the truth. but yea, after a while, its like that person never left. You know that they're there praying for you all and helping you out even... this kind of thing takes time...
Comments
2)To show grief for a death by conventional signs, as by wearing black clothes.
3) To make a low, indistinct, mournful sound. Used especially of a dove.
That is the definiton I got my sources from www.dictionary.com for people who don't know what mourn means
And MarMar to answer your 1st question, you know God is loving and caring, and cares about all of us, no matter who it is, and if we are baptized we have the holy spirit! So God want people to be happy than sad!
That is the definiton I got my sources from www.dictionary.com for people who don't know what mourn means
No No, I didn't misunderstood, I think you didn't see this part, I guess in this verse it is, but that's only my opinion I would like to see other people's opinion also!
Forever,
Coptic Servent
I'm sry im just taking a guess here, I'm just as clueless as you are... ???
Help, please ???
thats the right story.. rite?
This kind of mourning is to be distinguished from a sinful type of mourning – the mourning which leads to despair (2 Corinthians 7:10)
People can mourn for a departed loved one; but if they start giving up on God - they lose hope in His mercy, they refuse to pray, or go to Church etc.; or they start giving up on others - they reject those who love them, they no longer concern themselves with the needs of others, their life becomes self-centred and focused on their own misery and problems etc.; or they start giving up on themselves - they mope around all day crying, they become lazy and negligent in their responsibilities towards themselves, they refuse to continue achieving and succeeding in their life, they refuse to continue making the most of the gifts God has given them, they refuse to move forward but rather dwell on their depression and allow it to influence the way they act, think, and feel etc.; then, this is most definitely, and without question, a sinful reaction and cultivation of an otherwise perfectly natural human emotion, that may and should be cultivated and used to enhance one's relationship to God and others, and ultimately one's self.
sorry for getting in so late but here goes:
"Sorrow is better than laughter, For by a sad countenance, the heart shall be made better"(Ecclesiates 7:3)
I think the term mourining refers to those tears of repentence, and especially the mourning of those people who endure, and carry their crosses silently. I think we can relate this to what's going on in Alexandria right now... Mourning is very blessed because it purifies the heart. It rids it of all pride and jealosy and maliciousness until it finally sees itself as what it actually is--nothing. Through mourning you gain humility because you realize your error and you're clinging to God. When you're crying out to God, be it tears of joy, or of grief, its one of the most powerful prayers because its coming through your heart and God will accept that right away. (as opposed to someone who's just saying words and doesn't feel them) Not only will God accept these prayers but He'll come and hold your hand and wipe away your tears...
"For I, the Lord your God, will hold your right hand, Saying to you, 'Fear not, I will help you.'" (Isaiah 41:13)
Mourning is such a good thing, that the devil gets very envious and frustrated that he tries to make you fall into sin through it. H.H. Pope Shenouda says in Diabolic Wars that despair and sadness are two of the devil's intrigues (methods). He sees you sad and wanting to repent and he will tell you "God will never forgive you, you are filth and he will never accept you" the person then loses hope and falls into despair. In sadness, he might see a person who is repentant and gains humility and the devil will try to turn that humility-the greatest virtue- into sadness. He does this by telling you "you are not worthy to pray, who are you to talk to God?" and for instance he might tell a deacon, "who are you to deserve reading the Holy gospel? you're filthy hands aren't worthy to touch it. and who are you to sing those hymns.. only people worthy to sing should sing them not a filthy person like you"... in doing so the person loses the blessing he would have taken from the gospel, from the hymns...
Anyways, so mourning is an awesome thing just becareful because the devil tries to get you in every way he can.. be like Saint John the Short - he was such a virtuous man that the devils praised him and he would answer them "who am i the poor? have i acheived what saint Anthony and Anba Bemwa have acheived? I am all in sin..." and when they heard this, they would tell him, "You're right, you are filthy.. You are covered in sins, God will never accept you.." and this saint would reply to them by saying "but were are God's mercy and love..?" So then the devils were outraged and told him "You puzzle us, when we lift you up you humble yourself and when you humble you you lift yourself." H.H. Pope Shenouda says that this is how we should respond to the devils' attacks.
-Mariam
In funerals we're always asking God why and yelling at him, "how can You do this?" and crying... its not wrong to cry over someone that died, what's wrong is to be selfish because that person is with God now; to want them back here on earth is selfishness- i think to cry because you're going to miss that person is natural.. so it's definately not a sin to cry because we're going to miss that person but at the same time we should be happy because that person isn't dead, they're dead to the world and alive in Christ... we're the dead ones, if anything they should be mourning over us.. and pray a lot for that person.. pray A LOT for them.. Our hearts don't want to believe it.. when my friend died last year; it was like some kind of horrible joke- we all didn't want to accept it.. we even went pretty far in our efforts to avoid the truth. but yea, after a while, its like that person never left. You know that they're there praying for you all and helping you out even... this kind of thing takes time...