Guys,
I have got a weird problem, and am confused so I hope you guys can help me ???
First, I life in Europe. I am 17 years old and love the church and I am yet beginning with
'el gimda'( 3aded el goddam/lessons 2 be a sundayschool dinar).
In my church there's a abouna who I really love, and many people and youth love
him, and he is good in circumvent with the youth and he is also young (around 32).
He is so kind, and often give me his attention, trough hugging me, smiling, holding my hand, etc.
Last time, he visited me at home and I was very happy (still happy :P)
And we talked with him, and answered my questions about
the church, blesses the home,, hugged me, putted his hand on my leg etc.
My problem is: I love him very much and I think I have feelings for him like...you know :-[ I don't know HOW I love him, but I only know THAT I love him.
Of course I love other abouna's too, but I'm not thinking and dreaming about them like
I do about this abouna. I'm so ashamed, and don't want to talk about it with
someone, so please can you tell me what those feelings are and how I can take them away? I am so confused and desperated...
Thanks in advance and remember me in your prayers.
Comments
It means "OUR FATHER"
Priests MUST be kind loving people for two reasons - one is that they have become fathers for a whole congregation and people will need abouna's love first to then accept his guidance and correction. Secondly they must be good loving people in the first place for them to be chosen by God for this ministry. The normal reaction of young people to love and care is to love and care back so this shouldn't worry you that you care for this abouna. He is also young as you say so it is also normal to feel more connected to him than to other abounas. All of us have been at your age where you need more love and more attention as you develop into becoming a self-confident adult. Sometimes as the level of your emotions develop with age it becomes confusing as to where your emotions are set towards. This love that you have for this abouna is a normal love that is good but as you are experiencing new feelings it can confuse you as to whether this love is of a different kind. This is also normal but you need to be careful not to convince yourself that these feelings are for anything else and you must pray for guidance and clarification. My advice to you is to first thank God that He has given you a caring abouna who you feel comfertable talking to about your problems because many people don't have that. Secondly you should would not worry about your emotions as with God's help and as you mature you will differentiate between this type of love and a romantic love. May God bless you and protect you in this slightly confusing time and may He keep for you this blessed priest who loves and is loved by everyone.
God Bless,
GMAN
i have 2 points,
1. our coptic fathers were REALLY smart when they made the rule that you MUST be married to be a priest, or a monk. also priests are NEVER allowed to marry again if their wife dies. this makes sure that no abouna is EVER available for anything other than being a good father and friend. no-one fancies their own father who conceived them (if anyone ever does, pls send a pm, u obviously need help..) and abouna is your father above all else (as the least pointed out).
it's normal for people (esp young people or virgins - u see it's hard to be a nun or monk) to get confused about their feelings when they feel great admiration for people who work hard and teach them more of God, and for those feelings of love and admiration to be confused with something romantic. that's why priests are never available, so many people would love them and the priest would not know who to chose as a wife!
2. the devil is also quite smart! he sees some pure love in the heart of a good Christian and/or a good priest and tries to corrupt it, to make it seem like it was never true Christian brotherly love, just something 'romantic'. so suddenly all the nice times you had together are coloured by this dirty feeling. even if you are trying to be pure, our enemy tries to make it go just a little over the line, eg a hug that lasted a little too long, too intense eye contact etc.
the answer to this is to have strict boundaries. your boundaries will be different depending on the culture and circumstance, eg if i (in my 30's) shake hands with a man (in church) i don't know very well in his 80's, i might also squeeze his shoulder with my left hand, as i am like a daughter or grandaughter to him and he won't take it the wrong way. but if i do this with (eg) my boss, who is younger and tends to flirt with the ladies at work (he is not a Christian), it could be taken the wrong way. even though my feelings for him are pure (i like him, he is a good boss), i want to be sure he respects my boundaries. so if he gives my arm a squeeze, i smile to be polite, but don't do the same to him, so he is clear that i am not as 'free' as he is. obviously if he went really over the boundaries and touched something else, i would give him a short sharp pain, but i'm not discussing that here, i'm discussing this situation when someone is just a bit over the boundary and it causes confusion.
if someone does not respect your boundaries and gets offended, just say, 'i know your heart is pure, but it's good for men and women to have boundaries because we understand the strategies of the devil.' in some families, fathers will touch their daughter's leg (or mothers their sons') with pure affection and no evil thoughts. but a smart priest will say to himself 'although this young lady is still a small girl in my heart and memory, she actually has grown up now, so i should set stricter boundaries with her'.
so, i suggest to you that you bring these feelings to God and ask Him to clear up this confusion in your head and forgive you if you had any impure thoughts. read the psalms and pray the agpeya a lot and develop your love for God. when you are thinking of God all the time and willing to marry someone ugly for His glory or to be a nun or a martyr, and nothing else fills your heart as much as God's love, then there is no room for confusing thoughts. no-one should waste their thoughts on some dream of marrying the beautiful rich prince, because God probably wants this prince to marry someone ugly and poor so he leaves the sins of the world and looks at people's hearts instead. pray for your abouna because he is human and weak too, ask God to fill him with love for his wife or his monastic life, so that every time abouna comes into your thoughts, he is pictured with his wife and family, or with a group of old monks (if he is a monk).
ask God to give you a good female friend that you can hug without worrying if you are doing the right thing, and trust God to prepare a great path ahead for you, in the right job, either married or single, with the right friends, only He knows what is best for you, and only by doing His will, you will really be satisfied and complete.
But what do u mean with this part? (and about 'that's why priests are never available, so many people would love them and the priest would not know who to chose as a wife!' ?)
that's why priests are never available, so many people would love them and the priest would not know who to chose as a wife! And you said: [b]Do u mean here that it's not good that abouna hugged me and to tell him not to do it again?
pray for your abouna because he is human and weak too, ask God to fill him with love for his wife or his monastic life, so that every time abouna comes into your thoughts, he is pictured with his wife and family, or with a group of old monks (if he is a monk). Moreover, this abouna is married.
And I mean he don't really hug me like "hugging and I hugging back'' , but i mean 'hugging me of my side.
Is this also wrong?
And it's just a abouna who I really love, but actually i don't tell him my personal problems, beacause he is not my foc. My father of confession is a monk, (i'm sometimes ashamed to tell him about issues like that, cause he is a monk).
Guys,
I have got a weird problem, and am confused so I hope you guys can help me ???
I can confirm that your problem truly is weird. What do you mean "holding your hand" ? What is the "etc"?? is that the "etc"? Does he put his hand on your leg often? or is it once or twice? I'd say - stay away from this priest until he learns a few lessons in how to treat female members of his Church.
"Puts his hands on your legs and hugs you?"
I'd tell a Bishop and complain.
a few answers:
1. i mean imagine u r a priest who is single and available, you are looking for a wife in church, and you are surrounded by adoring young women who admire your study and commitment to God and who like to listen to you. how can you be sure which of these likes you for yourself and which is 'star-struck' because you are a priest giving her some attention? i believe you can't be sure, this is why our church makes sure this doesn't happen.
2. by 'boundaries' i mean those things that start you thinking that maybe he means more to you than just a friend and a priest. so everyone should have boundaries like no touching of those parts that you don't undress in public, no kissing except a small kiss on the cheek if you know that person really well (i kiss the old 'uncles' in the church on the cheek and one or two very close friends who are also good friends of my husband, but i don't normally kiss men on the cheek, a handshake is usually appropriate). these boundaries i didn't mention because i think it is (should be) obvious that if some of these happen, the person concerned should be sent to the bishop for discipline +/- police.
what i mean is that usually a quick hug of a good friend (including a priest) in the presence of a family member or other adult chaperone is usually ok, but if this is enough to make you have dreamy thoughts, maybe you should decline all hugs for now until you no longer are tempted to have these thoughts.
so i wouldn't tell him he shouldn't have hugged you, i expect (obviously i can't be sure) that this priest has innocent, friendly feelings for you and that he would feel bad if you tell him he was making a mistake. but you could say something like 'now i am an adult, i keep more distance from men, including all my friends who are men and the people i used to hug when i was a child.'
as this priest is married, i recommend the best strategy is to make friends with tasoni, help her in church (cleaning, teaching, cooking, whatever she does) and then you can still see your priest, but get hugs from his wife. not that hugging, by itself is wrong, just that sometimes we need to keep away even from normal things if there is any chance it could lead to sin (each person should watch out for their own weaknesses), like the monks who don't let women kiss their hand after mass, but instead draw it away. i used to think that was really extreme, but i have understood from my teachers in the church that it's better to be a bit extreme than to put yourself in a situation where you may be tempted.
a note to qt pa 2t,
maybe u r shocked i keep thinking the best of this priest and i didn't suspect he is a pervert. this is because i have met loads of egyptians and sudanese who grew up in the bosom of the church, whose only neighbours were strong Christians or strict muslims and who honestly have no idea about what goes on in the heads of people brought up in a more 'liberal' society. i work in a hospital, and, because of what my colleagues tell me and what i have seen at work, i never get shocked anymore at the level of depraved thoughts that people who don't know God can have.
but, really, some of my (church) friends are so incredibly innocent, they really have very little idea about how immoral some people are, i have been very surprised to hear that, but i can see it is true some people have an extreme innocence and they have to be specifically taught how to behave with the opposite sex in order not to cause offence.
so i hope this explains things, may God deliver us from all evil.
I appreciate your opinion. I would agree with you; however, I feel that she must explain this to a bishop because despite being westernised, it is wrong for a priest to touch the legs of a girl/woman of 17 years of age. This is totally wrong. It has nothing to do with culture. Trust me.
I know Anba Angaelos, and I love how he behaves with the girls. Very descent and loving. He would NEVER put his hand on their legs. This is wrong. And there is no bishop/priest more "western" than Anba Angaelos.
I would suggest you contact Sayedna Anba Angaelos and tell him this.
I'm not suggesting that this priest is a pervert. But his interpretation of "western" culture needs to be given a reality shock.
[quote author=*Bride of Jesus* link=topic=8520.msg107899#msg107899 date=1258837512]
Guys,
I have got a weird problem, and am confused so I hope you guys can help me ???
I can confirm that your problem truly is weird. What do you mean "holding your hand" ? What is the "etc"?? is that the "etc"? Does he put his hand on your leg often? or is it once or twice? I'd say - stay away from this priest until he learns a few lessons in how to treat female members of his Church.
"Puts his hands on your legs and hugs you?"
I'd tell a Bishop and complain.
He put his hand on my leg twice, when he visited me thursday and he was talking to me. He dont put it for a long time, just short. And my father was also in the room..
I personally think that's not Abouna who thinks something wrong, but I, and I don't know, but he is also kind to other girls, (but i dont saw he putt a hand on a leg).
I think its just my FEelings which confused me, and I know i am wrong with thinking that but i dont'know. He don't hug like face-to-face. but I stand beside him and then he hugged me with one arm.
And now THIS? A married abouna? Temptation is not a sin, but don't give into it. It's a struggle we all face. If when you are 'thinking' about this abouna, don't embellish or elaborate on this, but just ignore it and focus on something else. If you 'dream' about this abouna, then ignore it when you wake up. Simple as that.
He's a priest that's married. I don't think he would actually put his hand on your leg for lustful reasons. Maybe it's just a way of joking around. Many priests have different ways of showing appreciation of his congregation. Don't take it in a bad way. Maybe you're going a liiiitle too far with this. Remember this priest represents Jesus on Earth. He carries the Holy Body and Blood of Our Lord God and Savior Jesus Christ. If you feel uncomfortable, leave the room. Also if you feel it's something that should be reported than tell anba angelos.
GBU
Please pray 4 me
Marina
Maybe there was a bug on your leg and he was killing it. You never know. ;)
He's a priest that's married. I don't think he would actually put his hand on your leg for lustful reasons. Maybe it's just a way of joking around. Many priests have different ways of showing appreciation of his congregation. Don't take it in a bad way. Maybe you're going a liiiitle too far with this. Remember this priest represents Jesus on Earth. He carries the Holy Body and Blood of Our Lord God and Savior Jesus Christ. If you feel uncomfortable, leave the room. Also if you feel it's something that should be reported than tell anba angelos.
GBU
Please pray 4 me
Marina
I'd give the priest the benefit of the doubt; not because he's a priest, but from after reading your previous topic and taking your age into consideration, I think your emotions are so out of control, you're about to explode.
Take a cold shower and then post again in this forum and see if that makes a difference.
Stay away from men until you finish your degree and do at least 3 years voluntary service in Kenya.
Bride of Jesus................ You need to chill............ First this: http://tasbeha.org/content/community/index.php?topic=7412.msg97985#msg97985
And now THIS? A married abouna? Temptation is not a sin, but don't give into it. It's a struggle we all face. If when you are 'thinking' about this abouna, don't embellish or elaborate on this, but just ignore it and focus on something else. If you 'dream' about this abouna, then ignore it when you wake up. Simple as that.
Thanks sodr2,
oh, and about that link, I already stopped with it definitife (insha2allah) and don't make phonecalls or anything else anymore.
Thank you everybody for your advice, I'm wondering what you're thinking now of me.. :-[ and i agree that I think I exaggerated but please pray for my weakness, Rabena ma3akom.
we all have weaknesses, just keep logging into tasbeha.org, and our stories will eventually come out ;) i feel the same when i think of some of my posts!
don't worry, we'll probably never meet, if we do, i'm the small crazy one who makes inedible falafel ;)
Who says having a crash and being confused is only for teen girls? I for one can say I been in some serious crashes and it is always confusing. One thing that always helps to discern between genuine love that will culminate in marriage and trifle crashes is doing nothing (except praying). It might sound counter intuitive but it works. Don’t ask the other person for a phone number, or take them out on a date. If it is genuine love that God meant to be your actions would not stop it from happening.
I am saying the above in general concerning crashes.
In Christ
Theophilus
don't worry, we'll probably never meet, if we do, i'm the small crazy one who makes inedible falafel ;)
its TAMAYA not falafel...now email me some...
are very wise advices :) May I ask how old are you? (mabsoota, Theophilus 1 QT_PA_2T , marina etc? :P)
;) i will send you some ta'amiya if we are ever in the same country...
i'm fairly old (>30), i think the others are a little younger, but still very mature.
Apparently I'm "etc," no no age from me.
Well, I yet saw on ur profile you're 18 :P