thnx slyvia that wat B E A utiful, thnk u so much for sharing that, it made me think alot about my actionz, may God reward u for opening my eyes yet again!!
aww thank u so much...i acually feel lyk i confused everyone....i'm sorry guys i tend to do that when i have so much to say and so little time to type it... :(
Importance? Significance? These questions need to be dealt with care, and should be portrayed on your own experiences. Excuse my blatant interruption, but to what extent has Jesus aided in our lives..I like to label myself as an Atheist.
We believe that man was created by an eternal creator: God (Jesus is the Logos, Word, of God in the Flesh), and we all have an eternal spirit, which is what diferentiates us from other creations. Becaus we have an eternal spirit, it cannot be satisfied by any temporarly or eartly thing. THe only thing that can satisfy us fully, is God himself.
After man fell in sin, our nature changed and there was a barier that kept us away from God; sin, and we were doomed to eternal death becaus the wages of sin is death (Romans 6:23) . When Jesus came, he overcame sin and death, and gave us the ability to become children of God again (John 1:12), and grant us eternal life...
So, Jesus is the one that saves us from sin, so that we can enjoy being with God, which is the only thing that can satisfy us...
[quote author=Kryptik link=board=1;threadid=607;start=30#msg11698 date=1095404715] Importance? Significance? These questions need to be dealt with care, and should be portrayed on your own experiences. Excuse my blatant interruption, but to what extent has Jesus aided in our lives..I like to label myself as an Atheist. Peace...
Hey Kryptik: If you label yourself as atheist, can you tell us what do u believe in "as an atheist" (not what you don't beleive in)?
I'm jsut curious to know ... do you believe that your soul will parish with your body at death and that would be the end of you and your existance? If this is true, in your opinion, than humans should have no importance nor significance to exist on earth in the first place? what is it to live and die after few years? Just like dogs and cats and other animals??!! And how did humans got created? is it according to Darwin's theory of evolution? in this case, your view will be that humans are the descendants of apes??? :)
Ibrahim, whats your purpose on Earth? To serve God?When i say Atheist, i just dont believe in God because no faith has really interested me. And think about it, how could God expect to you believe such a miracle of some God dieing for us? In general, a book from God should be free from slurs...This goes for the Quran'i Kerim and others.
If God is soo merciful, why is the world sooo wrong? Is it Gods punishment for our sins? I tell you all, if you look at your faith from a different viewpoint, you shall see its more like a fairy tale.
Iqbal's defence of Christianity in past forums, clearly shows his rebuttles are subjective and not universally accepted. Btw...i hope, you can answer why Jesus doesn't help the Iraqi's, African's and the other oppressed societies. I just find it hard to believe the Merciful Jesus can sustain such a depressing world.
...i hope, you can answer why Jesus doesn't help the Iraqi's, African's and the other oppressed societies. I just find it hard to believe the Merciful Jesus can sustain such a depressing world.
Let me ask u a question: Did Jesus start the war in Iraq? Did Jesus caus the people in Africa to starve out of hunger becaus there is not enough food? Certainly not; there is enough food in this world but its not devided equally, in other words; the human beings, who have a free will, CHOSE to not divide the food equallly causing people to starve and live in poverty. Humans decided to start a war in Iraq, not Jesus, so how could u blame Him for such a thing.
[quote author=Kryptik link=board=1;threadid=607;start=30#msg11734 date=1095462907] Ibrahim, whats your purpose on Earth? To serve God?When i say Atheist, i just dont believe in God because no faith has really interested me. And think about it, how could God expect to you believe such a miracle of some God dieing for us? In general, a book from God should be free from slurs...This goes for the Quran'i Kerim and others.
If God is soo merciful, why is the world sooo wrong? Is it Gods punishment for our sins? I tell you all, if you look at your faith from a different viewpoint, you shall see its more like a fairy tale.
Btw...i hope, you can answer why Jesus doesn't help the Iraqi's, African's and the other oppressed societies. I just find it hard to believe the Merciful Jesus can sustain such a depressing world.
O.K. First you didn't answer my question, what is your belief of your destiney after death? Second, to answer your questions here we go: 1- Our purpose on earth as Christians is to witness to God and His word. There are many ways to do that, the least of them is to be a living example. "You are the light of the world .... you are the salt of earth: Mathew 5". Ofcourse no human being is perfect, so Christians should struggle through their entire life to reach the status of being a good example in each aspect of their lives, to be the salt of earth and light to the world. There are also many other ways, to teach people that "the Kingdom of heaven is approaching, and call them for repentence and baptism in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit through preaching, sunday schools, and missionaries". 2- God expects His elect to believe that He died for the entire humanity (Titus 1:1). He wants that all men be saved and believe in Him, that's His will (1Timothy 2:4). But it is the hard hearted people that put the limited human logic ahead and on top of believing what is beyond human capabilities and even imagination, the grace of God, and don't forget the most important miracle, the resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ, His divine will being risen after His death on the cross. He defeated death, that was His purpose to come and save us from the eternal death. You just cannot grasp on the concept of God being in pain himself to teach us how to endure such earthly pains. And than rise from death to pull us too with Him from the power of death. 3- God was, is and will always be merciful. It is His nature, not an emotional state, if you undestand what I mean. It's the human race which bring agony on itself. It's the evil that people allow it to control them. That brings an important question: do you believe that you had a will to choose or do you believe that you are fulfilling a certain destiny? If you're free to choose and you've chosen to do evil things, than you will eventually make people aroung you suffer. And one day somebody stronger will revenge from you and do evil things to you so you may suffer as well, and so on, what goes around comes around. It's called justice, and some inocent people suffer in the process which was invented by humans not God. The good people that suffers alongside the bad people will eventually be rewarded if not on earth, than in heavens. So it is the choice of people to make other people suffer. But there will be a day when the suffering will end and the chosen will be with God forever, and the evil will suffer loneliness and darkness forever. 4- Again, Jesus have given us the choice. You are free to choose to fight evil with evil and keep the cycle going forever, or fight evil with peace and love until peace prevail. Unfortunately people always choose fighting evil with evil. People in Iraq were suffering from Sadam (one of their own citizens) more than they are suffering now. He was evil, and now they are suffering more from arab terrorists than from Americans, again it's evil. And whoever takes by the sword, will eventually be taken by the sword, that's called justice. God will not eliminate evil on earth, but He gave us the tools and teachings to overcome evil. It's up to us and the world to either use it and live in peace or ignore and bear the consequences of our choices. 5- Finally, I do believe that you are a muslim and not an atheist, that's why you dodged my questions. Non moslems do not know that the quoran is called quoran el kerim! So I hope that your purpose here is not to argue with no intention to learn. I pray that God may show you the way, the light and the truth. And please, try to look beyond the human limited mind and flesh. May the grace of God be with you Ibrahim
Iqbal hold up and take a breath...We all realise that your defending your religion which obviously plays a major role in your life however, you have gone overboard..Your very desperate to let your explicit knowledge out and i respect that. In spite of that, g down brother..
Yeah guys, i agree with G.J.I, and Iqbal i think u might have understood AEK the wrong way....I think that what he was trying to say is that despite the fact that ur posts r unbelievably effective and strong and ur practically a role model for some of us, try to sorta be less defensive or demanding in ur answers. I mean they're absolutely magnificant, its just that when some one new to the site is still trying 2 learn about our faith we should try 2 welcome this opportunity and easily and slowly and sweetly show them the truth u kno? I really didnt think AEK meant to offend u, i just think he was trying to say like take it slowly, we all would love to defend our religion and bring ppl 2 Christ but that all involves prayer and taking it step by step....Iqbal ur truly gifted with many things u kno and i feel as though many of us could learn many things from u so please dont take this as offending or nething, i just wanted to tell u wut i thought AEK meant...but ...GBU!
[quote author=Kryptik link=board=1;threadid=607;start=30#msg11734 date=1095462907] If God is soo merciful, why is the world sooo wrong? Is it Gods punishment for our sins? I tell you all, if you look at your faith from a different viewpoint, you shall see its more like a fairy tale.
I believe that these forums are to ask questions so that one can grow more in their spiritual knowledge and their knowledge of Christ. As this is a Christian forum, that means that the spirit of christianity should be in it, a spirit of love and peace.
We are not here to fight with one another, but to learn
The world is not depressing, in fact the kingdom of heaven lies within us if we keep Jesus in our hearts. There might be much suffering and wars in the world, however that is not God's fault. God told us to love one another, and to love even our enemies, "But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you" Matthew 5:44,we humans, are the ones that chose to kill our fellow man in endless wars. He gave us free will, but we are the ones that dont use it wisely sometimes.
"If you wish to correct anyone from his faults, do not think of correcting him solely by your own means: you would only do harm by your own passions, for instance, by pride and by the irritability arising from it; 'but cast thy burden upon the Lord,' (Ps. 55:22) and pray to God 'Who trieth the hearts and reins,' (Ps. 7:9) with all your heart, that He Himself may enlighten the mind and heart of that man."- St. Gregory Palamas
Dear beloved sisters and brothers.
Let us make benefit of these forums. Let us work through the Spirit of the Lord - the Spirit of "love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness self-control" (Galations 5:22-23, NKJV).
If anyone has any SINCERE questions or concerns about ANY MATTER in their spiritual life, we welcome the question and we will try to help answer it together through the grace of God.
Let us pray to God that He may give us His peace.
God Bless You all. :)
- PS. this thread is about the Importance of Jesus. How can we discuss anything fruitfully (how can we talk about His importance) if we do not follow His greatest commandment, as Princess Mary Quoted, above:
"And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength.' This is the first commandment. "And the second, like it, is this: `You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' There is no other commandment greater than these." (Mark 12:30-31)
lol guys although i find this amusing plz refrain, if christianity teaches us something it teaches us to love our neighbour, it doesnt say love our christian neighbour and isolate urself from the rest, lets all accept each other, and disscuss things peacefully, like i said before, miricles can happen, people can change, if not by preaching, then my preaching through example my friend, u may think its imposible for an islamic person to convert and accept christ through a website, but let me tell u that moses was in a tougher situation infront of the red sea. lets have some love and peace, and lets accept everyone that comes to us, as those who are well have no need for a physician. i pray that we may grow and spiritually prosper through this site, and we may love each other with unconditional love.
[quote author=G.J.I link=board=1;threadid=607;start=45#msg11985 date=1095931845] lol guys although i find this amusing plz refrain, if christianity teaches us something it teaches us to love our neighbour, it doesnt say love our christian neighbour and isolate urself from the rest, lets all accept each other, and disscuss things peacefully, like i said before, miricles can happen, people can change, if not by preaching, then my preaching through example my friend, u may think its imposible for an islamic person to convert and accept christ through a website, but let me tell u that moses was in a tougher situation infront of the red sea. lets have some love and peace, and lets accept everyone that comes to us, as those who are well have no need for a physician. i pray that we may grow and spiritually prosper through this site, and we may love each other with unconditional love.
IQBAL!!! BE THE BIGGER MAN MAN!!! LOOK IM EVEN QUOTING MYSELF!!! /\/\/\/\/\/\ l l l l l l
[quote author=aek.. link=board=1;threadid=607;start=45#msg11982 date=1095924035] It's good that you believe Jesus Christ is protecting you, how about you chuck your self under a train and then you can make a real hypothesis... :D
(Matthew 4)
5 Then the devil taketh him up into the holy city, and setteth him on a pinnacle of the temple, 6 And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone. 7 Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.
Comments
may God reward u for opening my eyes yet again!!
GOD BLESS ALL! :-*
Peace...
We believe that man was created by an eternal creator: God (Jesus is the Logos, Word, of God in the Flesh), and we all have an eternal spirit, which is what diferentiates us from other creations. Becaus we have an eternal spirit, it cannot be satisfied by any temporarly or eartly thing. THe only thing that can satisfy us fully, is God himself.
After man fell in sin, our nature changed and there was a barier that kept us away from God; sin, and we were doomed to eternal death becaus the wages of sin is death (Romans 6:23) . When Jesus came, he overcame sin and death, and gave us the ability to become children of God again (John 1:12), and grant us eternal life...
So, Jesus is the one that saves us from sin, so that we can enjoy being with God, which is the only thing that can satisfy us...
i hope this helped :)
Importance? Significance? These questions need to be dealt with care, and should be portrayed on your own experiences. Excuse my blatant interruption, but to what extent has Jesus aided in our lives..I like to label myself as an Atheist.
Peace...
Hey Kryptik:
If you label yourself as atheist, can you tell us what do u believe in "as an atheist" (not what you don't beleive in)?
I'm jsut curious to know ... do you believe that your soul will parish with your body at death and that would be the end of you and your existance?
If this is true, in your opinion, than humans should have no importance nor significance to exist on earth in the first place? what is it to live and die after few years? Just like dogs and cats and other animals??!!
And how did humans got created? is it according to Darwin's theory of evolution? in this case, your view will be that humans are the descendants of apes??? :)
Peace!
Ibrahimf
If God is soo merciful, why is the world sooo wrong? Is it Gods punishment for our sins? I tell you all, if you look at your faith from a different viewpoint, you shall see its more like a fairy tale.
Iqbal's defence of Christianity in past forums, clearly shows his rebuttles are subjective and not universally accepted. Btw...i hope, you can answer why Jesus doesn't help the Iraqi's, African's and the other oppressed societies. I just find it hard to believe the Merciful Jesus can sustain such a depressing world.
Ibrahim, whats your purpose on Earth? To serve God?When i say Atheist, i just dont believe in God because no faith has really interested me. And think about it, how could God expect to you believe such a miracle of some God dieing for us? In general, a book from God should be free from slurs...This goes for the Quran'i Kerim and others.
If God is soo merciful, why is the world sooo wrong? Is it Gods punishment for our sins? I tell you all, if you look at your faith from a different viewpoint, you shall see its more like a fairy tale.
Btw...i hope, you can answer why Jesus doesn't help the Iraqi's, African's and the other oppressed societies. I just find it hard to believe the Merciful Jesus can sustain such a depressing world.
O.K. First you didn't answer my question, what is your belief of your destiney after death? Second, to answer your questions here we go:
1- Our purpose on earth as Christians is to witness to God and His word. There are many ways to do that, the least of them is to be a living example. "You are the light of the world .... you are the salt of earth: Mathew 5". Ofcourse no human being is perfect, so Christians should struggle through their entire life to reach the status of being a good example in each aspect of their lives, to be the salt of earth and light to the world. There are also many other ways, to teach people that "the Kingdom of heaven is approaching, and call them for repentence and baptism in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit through preaching, sunday schools, and missionaries".
2- God expects His elect to believe that He died for the entire humanity (Titus 1:1). He wants that all men be saved and believe in Him, that's His will (1Timothy 2:4). But it is the hard hearted people that put the limited human logic ahead and on top of believing what is beyond human capabilities and even imagination, the grace of God, and don't forget the most important miracle, the resurrection of our Lord Jesus Christ, His divine will being risen after His death on the cross. He defeated death, that was His purpose to come and save us from the eternal death. You just cannot grasp on the concept of God being in pain himself to teach us how to endure such earthly pains. And than rise from death to pull us too with Him from the power of death.
3- God was, is and will always be merciful. It is His nature, not an emotional state, if you undestand what I mean. It's the human race which bring agony on itself. It's the evil that people allow it to control them. That brings an important question: do you believe that you had a will to choose or do you believe that you are fulfilling a certain destiny?
If you're free to choose and you've chosen to do evil things, than you will eventually make people aroung you suffer. And one day somebody stronger will revenge from you and do evil things to you so you may suffer as well, and so on, what goes around comes around. It's called justice, and some inocent people suffer in the process which was invented by humans not God. The good people that suffers alongside the bad people will eventually be rewarded if not on earth, than in heavens. So it is the choice of people to make other people suffer. But there will be a day when the suffering will end and the chosen will be with God forever, and the evil will suffer loneliness and darkness forever.
4- Again, Jesus have given us the choice. You are free to choose to fight evil with evil and keep the cycle going forever, or fight evil with peace and love until peace prevail. Unfortunately people always choose fighting evil with evil. People in Iraq were suffering from Sadam (one of their own citizens) more than they are suffering now. He was evil, and now they are suffering more from arab terrorists than from Americans, again it's evil. And whoever takes by the sword, will eventually be taken by the sword, that's called justice. God will not eliminate evil on earth, but He gave us the tools and teachings to overcome evil. It's up to us and the world to either use it and live in peace or ignore and bear the consequences of our choices.
5- Finally, I do believe that you are a muslim and not an atheist, that's why you dodged my questions. Non moslems do not know that the quoran is called quoran el kerim! So I hope that your purpose here is not to argue with no intention to learn. I pray that God may show you the way, the light and the truth. And please, try to look beyond the human limited mind and flesh.
May the grace of God be with you
Ibrahim
GOD BLESS ALL! :-*
well said
;) ;)
If God is soo merciful, why is the world sooo wrong? Is it Gods punishment for our sins? I tell you all, if you look at your faith from a different viewpoint, you shall see its more like a fairy tale.
I believe that these forums are to ask questions so that one can grow more in their spiritual knowledge and their knowledge of Christ. As this is a Christian forum, that means that the spirit of christianity should be in it, a spirit of love and peace.
We are not here to fight with one another, but to learn
The world is not depressing, in fact the kingdom of heaven lies within us if we keep Jesus in our hearts. There might be much suffering and wars in the world, however that is not God's fault. God told us to love one another, and to love even our enemies, "But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you" Matthew 5:44,we humans, are the ones that chose to kill our fellow man in endless wars. He gave us free will, but we are the ones that dont use it wisely sometimes.
May the God of love and peace be with you
Dear beloved sisters and brothers.
Let us make benefit of these forums. Let us work through the Spirit of the Lord - the Spirit of "love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness self-control" (Galations 5:22-23, NKJV).
If anyone has any SINCERE questions or concerns about ANY MATTER in their spiritual life, we welcome the question and we will try to help answer it together through the grace of God.
Let us pray to God that He may give us His peace.
God Bless You all. :)
- PS. this thread is about the Importance of Jesus. How can we discuss anything fruitfully (how can we talk about His importance) if we do not follow His greatest commandment, as Princess Mary Quoted, above:
"And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your mind, and with all your strength.' This is the first commandment. "And the second, like it, is this: `You shall love your neighbor as yourself.' There is no other commandment greater than these." (Mark 12:30-31)
guys although i find this amusing plz refrain, if christianity teaches us something it teaches us to love our neighbour, it doesnt say love our christian neighbour and isolate urself from the rest, lets all accept each other, and disscuss things peacefully, like i said before, miricles can happen, people can change, if not by preaching, then my preaching through example my friend,
u may think its imposible for an islamic person to convert and accept christ through a website, but let me tell u that moses was in a tougher situation infront of the red sea.
lets have some love and peace, and lets accept everyone that comes to us, as those who are well have no need for a physician.
i pray that we may grow and spiritually prosper through this site, and we may love each other with unconditional love.
lol
guys although i find this amusing plz refrain, if christianity teaches us something it teaches us to love our neighbour, it doesnt say love our christian neighbour and isolate urself from the rest, lets all accept each other, and disscuss things peacefully, like i said before, miricles can happen, people can change, if not by preaching, then my preaching through example my friend,
u may think its imposible for an islamic person to convert and accept christ through a website, but let me tell u that moses was in a tougher situation infront of the red sea.
lets have some love and peace, and lets accept everyone that comes to us, as those who are well have no need for a physician.
i pray that we may grow and spiritually prosper through this site, and we may love each other with unconditional love.
IQBAL!!!
BE THE BIGGER MAN MAN!!!
LOOK IM EVEN QUOTING MYSELF!!! /\/\/\/\/\/\
l l l l l l
It's good that you believe Jesus Christ is protecting you, how about you chuck your self under a train and then you can make a real hypothesis... :D
(Matthew 4)