Dear All,
We want to make you aware of a patristics group we started in July of 2011. The group is Coptic Orthodox Patrological Theology (
COPT). We aim to discuss Coptic Orthodox theology through the lens of the Church Fathers.
We read books/treatises from the Fathers, then discuss them at meetings held via telephone or other remote conferencing (so that participants are not limited by any geographic region).
The co-founders of the group were motivated by a lecture by Fr. Tadros Malaty. In it, he talked about how knowledge of theology in the Coptic community is (and has recently been) on the decline. He said back in the 50s when the "Sunday School Movement" (the era of Pope Shenouda and other theologians like him) was on the rise, it had not been integrated into the Church. To the extent that when a group of youths would go to church to hold a meeting, they would have to hold their meeting outside.
As the leaders of the Sunday School Movement became clergy, the movement was integrated into the Church. At first, this resulted in a great revival of knowledge in the Coptic community. Eventually, however, all the responsibility was shifted to the priest. If someone questioned the Church, he would be directed to the priest. If someone questioned a doctrine, he would be directed to the priest. Naturally, the priest(s) of any one church could not handle all of this and knowledge started dwindling.
We've always had an interest in theology, and we felt we should do something after hearing Fr. Tadros Malaty, so we decided to organize COPT. Please visit our website and facebook page to learn more about us if you are interested. We've held 4 meetings thus far, and we are reading and discussing St. Basil's "On the Holy Spirit" in our next three meetings (first one to be on August 31).
COPT WebsiteCOPT Facebook Page
Comments
Dear All,
We want to make you aware of a patristics group we started in July of 2011. The group is Coptic Orthodox Patrological Theology (COPT). We aim to discuss Coptic Orthodox theology through the lens of the Church Fathers.
We read books/treatises from the Fathers, then discuss them at meetings held via telephone or other remote conferencing (so that participants are not limited by any geographic region).
The co-founders of the group were motivated by a lecture by Fr. Tadros Malaty. In it, he talked about how knowledge of theology in the Coptic community is (and has recently been) on the decline. He said back in the 50s when the "Sunday School Movement" (the era of Pope Shenouda and other theologians like him) was on the rise, it had not been integrated into the Church. To the extent that when a group of youths would go to church to hold a meeting, they would have to hold their meeting outside.
As the leaders of the Sunday School Movement became clergy, the movement was integrated into the Church. At first, this resulted in a great revival of knowledge in the Coptic community. Eventually, however, all the responsibility was shifted to the priest. If someone questioned the Church, he would be directed to the priest. If someone questioned a doctrine, he would be directed to the priest. Naturally, the priest(s) of any one church could not handle all of this and knowledge started dwindling.
We've always had an interest in theology, and we felt we should do something after hearing Fr. Tadros Malaty, so we decided to organize COPT. Please visit our website and facebook page to learn more about us if you are interested. We've held 4 meetings thus far, and we are reading and discussing St. Basil's "On the Holy Spirit" in our next three meetings (first one to be on August 31).
COPT Website
COPT Facebook Page
Very interesting! I wanted to start something like this at my own church, but alas no one was really interested.
btw, i checked an online dictionary and u can say 'patrological', but most theologians in the english-speaking world say 'patristic'.
I think many phone plans don't differentiate between Canada and the U.S. I'm pretty sure Google phone doesn't charge between the U.S. and Canada, so that's one option. Of course others can correct me if I'm wrong.
@Unworthy1
I know what you mean. A big part of why we are having the meetings remotely is to avoid the possible lack of "local" interest. So, even if only a few people are interested from each church, you still end up with a big group.
@mabsoota
You're absolutely right, but we wanted to use that word as the adjective for "Theology", so the equivalent would have been "Patristical" (which doesn't sound much less strange than "Patrological" :)).
in this type of phrase, the first noun takes the role of an adjective, but is still a noun.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apposition
this is the way this area of study is most frequently described by Christian theologians.
examples here:
http://www.amazon.com/Patristic-Theology-Protopresbyter-John-Romanides/dp/B0029D6XNY
http://www.catholicculture.org/culture/library/dictionary/index.cfm?id=35468
:)
Now I know who I'm asking to proofread our publications before they go out ...
Dear All,
We want to make you aware of a patristics group we started in July of 2011. The group is Coptic Orthodox Patrological Theology (COPT). We aim to discuss Coptic Orthodox theology through the lens of the Church Fathers.
We read books/treatises from the Fathers, then discuss them at meetings held via telephone or other remote conferencing (so that participants are not limited by any geographic region).
Can I suggest using goTomeeting, or even a PalTalk Private Room? What do you mean that it had not been integrated into the Church? Whenever I attend the passion week prayers, we are indeed priviledged to hear the homilies of the Church fathers - during this week and even on most Sundays.
Could you kindly elaborate a bit more on this point? Why? Well, I do believe also that knowledge of our theology is in decline, and indeed as you put it, if the priest does not know, then no one will answer. Its important indeed - for we pray in the liturgy - "WE PREACH YOUR DEATH O LORD, AND YOUR HOLY RESURRECTION WE ACKNOWLEDGE".
How can we preach His death if we don't know why He died?! For the reasons why He came to die are different than the reasons the Catholics and Protestants uphold. Our soteriology is different.
Our interpretation of Baptism is different.
May I recommend to you all the Divinity of Christ and Comparative Theology books also as the basis for any discussion?
He would say that Passion Week prayers were part of the Church during the 1950s, but theological Coptic youth meetings were not. Well, the author who wrote the two books you mentioned (Pope Shenouda), also wrote Salvation in the Orthodox Concept. Based on that book, he would probably say that our interpretation of Baptism is pretty similar to the Catholic Church's. That, however, is a topic for another day :).
I'm happy to take it up with you on COPT's forums.
Well, the author who wrote the two books you mentioned (Pope Shenouda), also wrote Salvation in the Orthodox Concept. Based on that book, he would probably say that our interpretation of Baptism is pretty similar to the Catholic Church's. That, however, is a topic for another day :).
I'm happy to take it up with you on COPT's forums.
Yes, indeed - you are 100% correct. lol.. but, the books on Divinity of Christ, or Comparative Theology are not focusing on soteriology. I have no idea why His Holiness has decided to use Anselm as a means to explain our salvation. But you better clear this up here and now - on this forum.
Your turn.
Not once does Pope Shenouda reference Anselm. He does talk about "infinite sin", but never talks about God needing to restore His lost honor (which is where Anselm became ridiculous). The phrase "infinite sin" can be interpreted in many non-problematic ways. For example, sin takes us away from the Infinite and therefore it is infinite because of Who we lose when we do it (God).
Your turn.
Thanks. My apologies if I misunderstood u. So what's wrong then with Comparative Theology and Divinity of Christ?
I was merely telling you that Pope Shenouda would disagree with your following statement (and I agree with him): That is why I said it is a topic for another day, because it deals with soteriology (a massive topic), not the two books you mentioned.
Pray for me my brother. :)
At some point we will start Christology, and seeing as how you are a fan of St. Severus, I am sure you will have a thing or two to say then :).
If you would like to join, please dial +1(619)564-3290 and use access code 14085 when prompted.
Go to our website to download our summary and for more information.
May God make this a fruitful discussion.