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Mistake in 15th Part of the Sunday Theotokia

JoeAskharoun
in Hymns Discussion
I noticed that, in part 15 for the Sunday Theotokia, the seventh stanza is incorrect; it should be "They likened the golden urn," rather than "There was a golden table". The Arabic and Coptic seem to be correct.

On a related note, is it possible for a user to have editing privileges, or is that reserved for the site admins (lookin at you, minatasgeel!)?

Thank you!

Comments

  • Daniel_Kyrillos
    Hi Joe,
    The stanza is correct. “Etrapeza” (on mobile at the moment so Coptic is inconvenient, sorry) is loaned from Greek to mean “table.” The exact word used in the Theotokia (“ti-etrapeza”, the table) is used in the Sherat (Saturday Lobsh) as well to mean table. I’ve also done a quick check and found that it’s also used in Psalm 22:5, which is the Psalm of the Liturgy of Holy Thursday. The relevant portion (“You prepare a table before me...”/“Ak-sovti en-ou-etrapeza em-pa-emtho evol”) also uses etrapeza. I don’t think it would make sense for David to say that the Lord prepared an urn before him in the presence of his enemies.

    Misunderstandings like this are exactly the reason mina and the admin team for this site have it so you can only edit portions you contribute.

    Pray for us!
    -Daniel
  • minatasgeelminatasgeel
    edited December 2020
    @JoeAskharoun.

    So, first, please consider that the text in there is liturgical in essence and is used in St. Mark's Jersey City. While I have been the one who is editing for many years, many have contributed and are still doing so in many ways, one of which, and most important in my opinion, is translation. However, I don't easily change things, specifically if its in english and the congregation already knows it. This is not an academic source. That's the reason we don't allow anyone to add or delete or even edit anymore. 

    About your specific comment, i wonder if you are confusing it with another verse:
    Auen ]`trapeza `nnoub@ hijen pima `nerswousi@ `pwik `n]`pro;ecic@ hijen `Pcwma `m`P[oic.

    This is the verse that says "They likened...." The one you are talking about it:
    Ouon ou`trapeza `nnoub@ ,y qen ]`ckyny@ `pwik `n]`proc;ecic@ ,y `e`hryi `ejwc.

    And that one does have the correct translation like @Daniel_Kyrillos said.
  • JoeAskharoun
    Alright, I understand regarding editing; I was just curious.

    Regarding the verse, I think we might be referencing different parts. I'm not confusing the verse for the 14th part; actually, the verse I'm talking about is in the 15th part, and seems to be copied from the 14th part.
    The relevant verse in the 15th part reads "Auen pi`ctamnoc `nnoub@ hijen }par;enoc@ pefkesi `mmanna@ hijen Pencwtyr." Unless I know much less Coptic than I think, the English doesn't match the Coptic: "There was a golden table, in the tabernacle, and the oblation bread, was placed upon it."
    The English in the book I have from my church in LA reads "They likened the golden urn: to the Virgin: and the Manna: with our Savior." The exact translation is almost certainly different.
    I feel fairly confident in saying that "hijen Pencwtyr" is definitely not "was placed upon it".

    Anyway, I appreciate the response, and I really do love this site!
  • ophadeceophadece
    @JoeAskharoun,
    You are right in all your explanation but where on this website have you found the mistake? I can't seem to find it unless it is not working well with android!
    Ⲟⲩϫⲁⲓ ϧⲉⲛ Ⲡϭⲥ
  • minamakar
    He's referring to the text here. http://tasbeha.org/hymn_library/view/479

    I wouldn't use the word 'urn' though. 'Jar' or 'pot' are better translations. An urn usually contains someones ashes whereas a pot is used to store things.
  • minatasgeelminatasgeel
    I found it. Yes, there was a mistake in the english text (duplicate from another paragraph)...that's a copy and paste mistake that's specifically in that page--it was not a mistake in translation.

    And, like minamakar said, the text we used is 'pot'...mainly, and i think i looked into this a while ago, KJV and probably NKJV uses 'pot'... I would of liked to use 'vessel,' But i would rather stick to some kind of consistency. So, 'pot' it was from the original Queen Psalmody book, and 'pot' it shall be. 
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