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The Rosary for the Coptic Church

kimitkimit
edited December 1969 in Faith Issues
I was wondering the importance of the Rosary for the Coptic Church, anyone can help me?

Comments

  • Unknown
    It has none. The Rosary was a later Western developement of the Roman Catholic Church.

    Peace.
  • kimitkimit
    Ok but what about the Appearence of the Vergin Mary in Fatima who said that the Rosary is the last mean to save our souls?
    Thanx.
  • Unknown
    The Orthodox Church doesn't take official positions on alleged apparitions that occur outside her jurisdiction. However, if such a statement was declared during the apparition at Fatima (and this is the first time I've heard so), then this would be evidence of the spuriousness of the apparition in the first place.

    Peace.
  • kimitkimit
    Can you help me understand? What do you mean by "this would be evidence of the spuriousness of the apparition in the first place"?
    Thanks.
  • Unknown
    It would be an indication that the apparition was not genuine i.e. it was not really St Mary who spoke those words.

    Peace.
  • kimitkimit
    Ok but you know that there were 40000 who saw the miracle of the sun. Why shouldn't we believe this appearence?
  • Unknown
    That doesn't make it genuine in the sense that God was behind it all. We are told to test such events; if an alleged apparition purports false doctrine or misleads people in any other way, then this is evidence against its authenticity.

    In any event, I have never heard that such a statement concerning the Rosary was declared at Fatima, so maybe you want to double check your sources.

    Peace.
  • socoolbishoysocoolbishoy

    That doesn't make it genuine in the sense that God was behind it all. We are told to test such events; if an alleged apparition purports false doctrine or misleads people in any other way, then this is evidence against its authenticity.

    A good example of that is a dude, who's name is mytria (or something close to that) he performs "miracles" and appears, and disappears in front of hundreds of people... and oh yeah he says he is the antichrist... the devil is a tricky dude... he knows how to make people fall, and knows how to trick people...
  • PrincessMaryPrincessMary
    yes, thats a good example, but if a person is not from God u can see that he is there to trick you. When st mary appeared in Fatima she appeared to many people and was trying to get them closer to God, if it is from the devil, the devil wouldnt be trying to get u closer to God, but astray from God

    Ok but what about the Appearence of the Vergin Mary in Fatima who said that the Rosary is the last mean to save our souls?

    St. Mary did tell them to pray the rosary (if you read the book that Lucia, 1 of the 3 children whom st mary appeared to wrote about st mary's apparitions), however she did not say it is the only or last means by which to save our souls, the rosary is a prayer so that God may have mercy on us and forgive us our sins. just as in our church we say "Hail to you. We ask you, O saint, full of glory, the ever virgin" and "We exalt you, the Mother of the true Light", prayer by itself is not the only way/means for salvation, not everyone who says father father shall enter the kingdom of heaven (Matthew 12:50), but its also by our deeds and actions
  • kimitkimit
    Yes you're right Princess Mary. Lucia did not say that the Rosary was the "unique" way to save our souls but the "last" way God gives us to save our souls. After that there will be no more ways. That's it.
    Do you think Fatima's apparition was fake?
  • Unknown

    St. Mary did tell them to pray the rosary (if you read the book that Lucia, 1 of the 3 children whom st mary appeared to wrote about st mary's apparitions), however she did not say it is the only or last means by which to save our souls

    I didn't think so. I don't believe there is anything inherently wrong with the rosary prayer; the basis of the words themselves finds its origin in Orthodox liturgical worship, however regarding the context in which it is employed by Catholics i cannot comment since I am not aware of why and how they use the prayer.

    In any event there is still other issues associated with Fatima that undermine its authenticity; her claim to be the "Immaculate conception" as well as her statement concerning purgatory are all signs that this apparition was misleading and intended to draw focus away from Christ and to confirm false doctrine.

    Peace.
  • Unknown

    way to save our souls but the "last" way God gives us to save our souls. After that there will be no more ways.

    Our souls are not saved by praising The blessed virgin; such acts as well as asking her to intercede on our behalf are simply secondary instruments/means, through which we are helped and supported along our path to salvation through Christ and Him alone (St Mary is NOT "co-redemptrix"). If such was ever stated by the figure in question, then this figure would by no means be accepted as St Mary from the Orthodox perspective.

    Peace.
  • kimitkimit
    [quote author=Iqbal link=board=1;threadid=1950;start=0#msg29484 date=1119720319]

    In any event there is still other issues associated with Fatima that undermine its authenticity; her claim to be the "Immaculate conception" as well as her statement concerning purgatory are all signs that this apparition was misleading and intended to draw focus away from Christ and to confirm false doctrine.
    Peace.

    Yes I was asking myself about that point. Did St. Mary ever speak to any orthodox as she did with catholics?
  • kimitkimit
    [quote author=Iqbal link=board=1;threadid=1950;start=0#msg29486 date=1119720598]

    (St Mary is NOT "co-redemptrix")

    Are you sure St. Mary is co-redemtrix for Catholics?
  • PrincessMaryPrincessMary
    she is for the catholics, however we do not believe she is, only God can offer redemption.

    I dont believe in the immaculate conception, no 1 is without sin except for God.

    But i was just saying that i dont think saying "hail mary full of grace" is wrong, i think its a nice prayer

  • kimitkimit
    Do you know if the second part (Saint Mary mother of God pray for us the sinners...) is a catholic add?
    Thanks.
  • Unknown

    Yes I was asking myself about that point. Did St. Mary ever speak to any orthodox as she did with catholics?

    What I do know is that the greatest apparition in Coptic History is that of Zeitoun, a silent presence of the Holy St Mary; she wasn't misleading anyone or teaching false doctrine, nor she did draw focus away from her Son (but rather bowed to and revered the Cross on the top of the Church dome). This apparition was officially confirmed by the Coptic Orthodox Church. You can find more info about it here:

    http://www.zeitun-eg.org/

    Peace.
  • PrincessMaryPrincessMary
    we ask for St. Mary's intercession and we ask for others saints intercessions like St. George....etc, and say" pray to the lord on our behalf that He may forgive us our sins"
    the end of hail mary says "holy mary mother of God pray for us sinners both now and at the hour of our death"
    i dont think its a catholic add, just maybe some simmilarity, i dont know

    i think the apparitions dont really matter ( i mean its wonderful that she appeared but), st mary appearing or not appearing should not affect our faith in any negative way
  • miko_1
    [coptic]ghgcb jklfnbv ikovfij gfkjfd[/coptic]
  • gigglyshygigglyshy
    [quote author=kimit link=topic=1950.msg29469#msg29469 date=1119711427]
    I was wondering the importance of the Rosary for the Coptic Church, anyone can help me?


    The Rosary is not apart of Coptic tradition, it's a Roman Catholic tradition. The Eastern Orthodox and the Oriental Orthodox have something similar though, where you pray the Jesus Prayer and some have knotted bracelets or ropes that they use to count their prayers. The Jesus Prayer is common amongst the Orthodox, while the Rosary prayers are popular amongst the Roman-Rite Catholics.
  • Anglican
    Praying the Rosary is one of the ways in which Christianity in the west developed in the period following the schism of 1054. It is not part of our tradition, and whilst perfectly appropriate practice for Catholics, is, as has been said previously, not something done by the Orthodox.

    Any apparition that placed great emphasis upon just those points where we and the Catholics part company - the Immaculate Conception and Purgatory being two of the main issues between us (along with the filioque and Papal primacy) - is, I would fear, being 'spun' to emphasise a partisan point.

    The Rosary itself consists of a series of prayerful reflections on the kernel of our salvation, and the main prayers are the Lord's prayer, the Hail Mary and the Gloria - there is nothing in any of these prayers which is not Orthodox - except their practice in this form.

    From my days as a High Anglican I have my old rosary - and very useful it is too when counting the 41 kyries!

    In Christ,

    Anglian
  • ckbadir
    I am amazed how we have to see with our proper eyes to be able to believe. Are we Thomas? Jesus said " blessed are those who will believe without seeing" . Virgin Mary made many apparitions through the history. Of which in Fatima, Lourdes ... etc. Should we have attended all these apparitions all over the world and along the history to believe that they were not fake ?! Her messages during these apparitions were all stressed on the necessity of prayers. Don't the Coptic Orthodox Church believe in the necessity of prayers ? One of the effective prayers that Jesus taught us by himself is "Our Father..". He knows that it is a prayer loved by God. As for the "Hail Mary full of Grace .."it is a prayer also loved by God and dear to him because it is praising His dear holy Mother. Imagine how many blessings we could get while we are between the hands of Saint Mary asking for Her intercession !
    The person who prays the Rosary will get multiple Blessings the Virgin Mary promised. She appears until now is Medijorie in Bosnia .. and always asks for prayers to save the world from the anger of God because of the growing number of sinners . Should the apparitions of Zeitoun be attended by all the world to be believed in ?? Search please for the web site of the Apparitions of the Virgin Mary and you will get more information about the other apparitions which happened before we were born and outside our country. Thanks
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