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Excommunication in the Church

alpha-and-omegaalpha-and-omega
edited December 1969 in Coptic Orthodox Church
This week I discovered that the Coptic pope has the authouroty to excommunicate people. I thought that only the Catholics do this. It does not seem right that another human can tell someone that they will not enter Heaven because they have declared it. I need some help on this issue.

Comments

  • [Deleted User]
    i think the church as a whole can excommunicate a person if he is heretical. such as arian and his heresy, and nestorious, and others. their heresy in its nature was a denial of our faith and our savior. as christians we cannot let it stand. we must represent our king on earth.
  • Coptic-IriniCoptic-Irini

    It does not seem right that another human can tell someone that they will not enter Heaven because they have declared it

    excommunicating someone from church has nothing to do with entering heaven right? the pope just excommunicates ppl who does not share our thoughts and views about religion and theology, just like Epnomos EnTaio said
  • SafaaSafaa
    This excommunication is given to the apostles and after that to the Apostolic Church by the Lord Himself.
    “ Truly, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven." Matthew 18:18

    This authority was used since the early days of the church and should be used by the church now.
    This kept the Coptic Orthodox Church one body and one faith.
    through out the twenty centuries.

    Major examples of excommunication are: Arius, Nestorus, Eutyches, Apollinarius, Macedonius,...
  • Coptic-IriniCoptic-Irini
    Oh okay...I'm sorry :-[ Thanks Safaa :)
  • StVictorStVictor
    Im not exactly sure, but i think, after excocommunication one could repent and be united with the Church once more.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, because im not positevly sure.
  • SafaaSafaa
    You are absolutely right StVictor, but heretics usually had reached to the point of hardening of their heart that they won’t repent, they already had blasphemed the Holy Spirit.

  • jmaziounjmazioun
    [quote author=Safaa link=board=4;threadid=2799;start=0#msg43206 date=1132953255]
    This excommunication is given to the apostles and after that to the Apostolic Church by the Lord Himself.
    “ Truly, I say to you, whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven." Matthew 18:18


    I got a question then? Does that mean that anybody excommunicated from the church can not go to heaven?
    Werent St Nectarious and St John Chrysostom both excommunicated from the church?
  • alpha-and-omegaalpha-and-omega
    So an excommunicated person can repent and the church will not aknowledge that they are excommunicated?
  • CopticPeteCopticPete
    Basically when a person is excommunicated, he banished from ever setting foot into an OE church. However, if he repents for what he did, he can be let back in, and if this repentence is a false one, lets just say that he might end up like arius. So ya, if he repents, the ban is lifted from him and he can come back into the church.
    Also to answer your questio doit4Jesus, yes once they are excommunicated they're link to heaven is gone, if they do not repent and be welcomed back to the church, then he will not be able to enter heaven.

    -Pete
  • SafaaSafaa
    doit4Jesus and Alpha and Omega,

    Of course if any person truly repent from his/her heart and acknowledge that he/she were wrong in their beliefs and confess their sinful heretic believes and having the absolution from the bishop, then they can be admitted to the church once more and share in the Holy Eucharist.

    I heard of a person who adopted the Jehovah witness, and after that went back to the Mother’s Church, after confessing their erroneous believe.
  • jmaziounjmazioun
    St John Chrysostom did not repent and come back since we beleive the church wrongly banished him, the same with St Nectarios. So how can we beleive that somebody excommunicated goes to hell when we accept them as saints??
  • SafaaSafaa
    Those two saints were wrongly accused and for Saint John Chrysostom, he reposed while in exile, so there is no need for repentance, since they did not commit any heresy, Both of these saints are venerated by the universal Apostolic Churches.
  • jmaziounjmazioun
    forgive my scepticism, but isnt it a bit too convenient to say that they were alright to go to heaven when they were excommunicated because we later venerated them as saints, but as for anybody currently excommunicated, he will not go to heaven?

    And another question, i heard plenty of people on this site say that the oriental orthodox church (us) has excommunicated the other churches from us throughout history due to heresy and other issues, does that mean they won't go to heaven either?
  • SafaaSafaa
    doit4Jesus,

    I do not understand you first paragraph, so I will answer your second one.

    It is not up to any one to say that someone will go to heaven and someone else will not, The Judgement is in the hand of the Lord only, as mentioned in the Holy Bible. So it is silly to speculation or even address this subject, but at the same time The Almighty God Gives the Church the power to bind and loose, as I mentioned before.
    From the Coptic Church point of view, the Church is the Kingdom of God on earth, so if the church excommunicates someone, it is not a pretty scenario for that person, he / she has to solve this problem before it is too late.
  • jmaziounjmazioun
    Thanks for that, very reasonable answer, I just get upset when people say we are the only one true church spoken about in the bible, the one baptism, everyone else is excommunicated outside of the church of Christ, that doesnt make sense to me, makes us sound like we are like the mormons, and that we are limiting the grace of salvation to our own community.
    I think its evident that God is working through many other churches around the world, even if they dont have the depth of Orthodoxy.
  • StavroStavro
    [quote author=alpha-and-omega link=board=4;threadid=2799;start=0#msg43197 date=1132948761]
    This week I discovered that the Coptic pope has the authouroty to excommunicate people. I thought that only the Catholics do this. It does not seem right that another human can tell someone that they will not enter Heaven because they have declared it. I need some help on this issue.

    - Excommunication is not the invention of the Church, and one important recorded case of excommunication was that relating to the sinner of Corinth who St.Paul excommunicated for a grave sin. So it is biblical and Traditional. In this case, it worked and the sinner repented.

    - Excommunication, in most cases, is a medicine and its effect depends on the response of the excommunicated person and on the way ot is handled by the Church. If the excommunicated person becomes stubborn, he will deviate more and more having been cut from the source of repentance. For the Church, in cases that are not related to faith but to sin, the Church should watch for the exommunicated person and try to bring him back.

    - Excommunication is a bishop's decision, according to his discretion. Because the Pope is the local Bishop of Alexandria, Cairo and many dioceses in the West that have no bishop (yet), he can exercise this right in the dioceses under his leadership.

    However, the Pope is also the head of the Holy Synod which is the highest authority in the Coptic Church. When a heresy or false teaching appears in a certain diocese, and the bishop fails to encounter it with the necessary measures, or when its influence exceeds the diocese and becomes a matter of general concern for the Holy Synod, then it is possible that the Pope acts through the Holy Synod and takes the necessary actions to accomplish his number one task: "Deliver the faith as he received it."
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