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Why does Abouna...
hello Copts! alright one simple question... after the sermon Abouna washes his hands and hold a towel and says i have sinned forgive me... alright wat does that mean.. y does he wash his hands and wipe them with a towel??
Enough
Enough
Comments
Hegomen Athanasius Iskander explains it as follows in his book Understanding the Liturgy:
GB
Tony
I never got that how come we say:
"Crucified under Pontious Pilate"
When PP washed his hands of Christs Blood?
Like why do we still consider him guilty of the Lord's Blood.
pls explain it to me...i want to know it
pp4m
but that was the will of god...so why is he gulty for that if it was the will of god? the same with judas....its the will of god....so why are they guilty? i mean god saved us cause of his crucification....so why are they guilty?
u can't blame it on God. God knows what happends and what will. He gives us freewill even thoo He knews what wikll choose. But we always have a choise. Pilete could kept Crhist from being cricified; he had that power.......Judas could of repented as St.Peter; but he didn't and brought death to himself in the lowest of hedes.
pls respond
pp4m
Pilate and Judas did not have to do anything. Judas freely chose to betray Christ despite Christ warning him beforehand about it. Now, the question becomes, what is the difference between Judas and Peter? They both denied and betrayed their Master correct? They both were forewarned about their denial and betrayal as well, correct? So what makes Peter a great saint, and Judas such a cursed person? Peter repented, wept bitterly and did not lose hope. Judas did not. Judas wept bitterly over what he did, but he did not repent and he lost hope.
Now, in the case of Pilate, we know he was the governor of Palestine. We also know, from history, that at the time of Christ, his position and power was very weak. Thus, Pilate was very easily influenced by the Jewish authority. That being said, he still could have freed Christ if he wished. However, instead of doing that, he washed his hands trying to show that he was innocent of Christ's blood. The thing is, he wasn't. Crucifixion, as we know from history, was a common form of punishment carried out by the Romans. Granted, it predates the Romans, but they perfected the technique. So, even though the Jewish authority called for Jesus' death, it was Pilate who granted it to them, despite the fact that he knew that Jesus was innocent.
I just finished reading a very interesting article by the late Father Matta el Meskeen called 'The Vast Bounds of Faith in God'. It is quite an insightful article and discusses how God, in His omnipotence, is able to turn the evil that men do, into good. He uses it as part of His ultimate plan in the end. The death of Christ is and example of this.
We are all held accountable for our actions and decisions (whether good or bad). I'm not sure what you mean when you ask about guilt though. Guilty of what exactly?
They are not guilty of the crucifixion per se. They are guilty of condemning an innocent man though. Judas betrayed his Lord and Master to the unbelievers, and Pilate allowed for the death of a Man he knew to be innocent. It is those actions that they are guilty of. As for the death of Christ, you and I know that we are all responsible for that because of our sins.
GB
Tony
God has given us all free will, therefore it is not, strictly speaking, God' will that Pilate and Judas were guilty of anything - it was their freely taken choice. Like all of us, they were responsible for what they did. They couldn't blame fate, God, or any of the other things people sometimes like to blame instead of putting it where it belongs - on oneself.
Hope that helps a little.
In Christ,
Anglian
pp4m
[quote author=Αριψαλιν link=topic=5404.msg72044#msg72044 date=1181129559]
but that was the will of god...so why is he gulty for that if it was the will of god? the same with judas....its the will of god....so why are they guilty? i mean god saved us cause of his crucification....so why are they guilty?
u can't blame it on God. God knows what happends and what will. He gives us freewill even thoo He knews what wikll choose. But we always have a choise. Pilete could kept Crhist from being cricified; he had that power.......Judas could of repented as St.Peter; but he didn't and brought death to himself in the lowest of hedes.
There are levels in Hades?
There are levels in Hades?
yes as there is levels in Heaven. like for example we know that Judas is in the lowest part of Hades.
there is "gohanam we gahim" and "el fardous wel sama2 el sama2eya" that are the four we hav...the moslim belive in seven hells and seven heavens.....
dispite that. Heaven is a place and Pradise is another. same to Hell and Hades.
Pradise is the waiting place for Heaven.
Hades is the waiting plase for Hell.
now in Heaven and Hell have levels.
btw, there is 4 heavens.
I have a question, does anybody know what the Church's stance is on Dante's Inferno?
It is what it is: a medieval Italian work of poetry. As such it has absolutely no dogmatic position within Orthodoxy (nor any other position for that matter).
The fact that it speaks of things such as purgatory - a concept totally rejected by the Church - is enough to suggest that one should not take it too seriously (though I don't think Dante ever intended to produce anything more than a symbolic work of poetry).
Unless, it says that Judas is in hell in the Bible (which, to my knowledge, it doesn't, though it greatly condemns him), we cannot make that statement because we do not know what was in his heart.
He committed suicide.....Christ Himself have said, praying to the Father, thanking Him for giving Him the twelve where they will all be saved except the son of perdition.
John 17:12
While I was with them in the world, I kept them in Your name. Those whom You gave Me I have kept; and none of them is lost except the son of perdition, that the Scripture might be fulfilled. I don’t know much about this but according to my research he includes Purgatory which we don’t accept.