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Romans chapter 1

f753789f753789
edited December 1969 in Faith Issues
hi

can someone pls clarify this Bible verse for me..
..is it talking about homosexuality?
and what is the deal with natural and unnatural?..i am kinda confused..
26 For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. 27 Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due.
Romans 1:26-27

in addition i find it worthy to mention that later on in Romans 1
28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased mind, to do those things which are not fitting; 29 being filled with all unrighteousness, sexual immorality,[c] wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness; they are whisperers, 30 backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, 31 undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, unforgiving,[d] unmerciful; 32 who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them.
it is interesting how disobedience to parents is put in the same category...as all those other things (i.e. haters of God..etc) meaning that this sin has its same severity to all those other sins stated..
kinda a scary thought..

anyways..i have a question about this portion too...what would be considered evil mindedness? or examples of it..

thanx in advance
keep me in ur prayers..(finals!!)
-sister in Christ

Comments

  • ophadeceophadece
    Dear perfectsinner,
    Yes, the first two verses do refer to homosexuality as I understand. I am not very good at interpreting or explaining what the Bible says, but this is what I personally understand. And, yes, you are right; even disobeying our parents is counted as a very serious matter; however, I disagree about labelling a sin "bigger" than another, or just a "blip"; sin is sin, however small, or big. I think the biggest sin though, is blaspheming against the Holy Spirit, which obviously leads to death if not been repented thoroughly.
    God bless you and pray for us a lot
  • Anglican
    Dear Perfectsinner,

    These are verses very relevant to our world since they show how once we abandon ourselves to the lusts of the flesh we subvert the whole natural order of things. They also address the common modern view that God will not judge us and that 'anything goes'. The last is not true, and St. Paul reminds us that God will judge us. The sins of the heathen do not come from ignorance but from their own sinful will - just as our sins do, so we'd better not try making that excuse. But note, he does not say that God destroyed them, He simply stopped looking after them because they denied their Creator.

    St. Paul gives us plenty examples of evil-mindedness - essentially everything that goes against God's commandments and His teachings through the Incarnate Word and the Church He founded. We have free-will - and if we exercise it according to our own pride it may damn us; if we exercise it according to His will we shall walk in His way and become more like Him in spirit.

    The choice is our choice - and how often do we get it wrong?

    In Christ,

    Anglian
  • f753789f753789
    hi
    thanx every1..those were great responses
    if i may ask ...so was he talking about homosexuality as the natural ..unnatural thing?

    and anglian

    The choice is our choice - and how often do we get it wrong?

    unfortunatly i never make the right choice..i am not even worthy of using the word often...it is more like ALWAYS

    ophadace..i disagree with u..i think that there r different degrees to sin..to a minimal extent
    b/c the literal definition of sin is distance or separation from God..

    for example
    say i fell asleep and did not pray and do matanias for 1 day...(and this person usually does them regularly and it was just this one day)...and someone that commited the sins of gossiping and judging...i dont think they r on the same degree..they r 2 extremes..

    but if someone gossips and someone murders..those 2 sins would be on the same scale..b/c gossip is indirectly murder..b/c it murders ones reputation..

    i may be wrong pls correct me ..for my benefit and the benefit of others

    thanx alott

    pls pray for me
    -sister in Christ

  • jydeaconjydeacon
    I agree with you there are different degrees to sin to a certain extent. God will not judge some one who curses the same as someone who murdered or committed adultery, and yes the he was talking about homosexuality being the unnatural thing. and i think that evil mindedness, is planning on doing a sin or completely knowing that you are doing a sin and still want to go through with it and don't really care about the consequences, hope i helped
  • ophadeceophadece
    Dear perfectsinner and jydeacon,
    I am not sure if I do agree that sins are different; and there are varying degrees for each. However, I might be wrong. Would someone explain this more to me?
    Another thing; will the faithful be judged on judgment day? Or is it only the unfaithful? I don't remember where in St. Paul's I think is saying the faithful will not be judged but they will be graced with God's grace entering the Kingdom of Heaven... what do you think?
    God bless you all and pray for us a lot
  • HolmesHolmes
    [coptic]+ Iryny nem `hmot>[/coptic]

    Regarding the notion of different degrees of sin, I had always thought that in the eyes of God, all sins are the same.  The wage of all sin is, afterall, death, as Paul teaches us.  However, I have just recently finished reading the Epistles of John, and came across the following passage:

    If you see your brother or sister committing what is not a mortal sin, you will ask, and God will give life to such a one-- to those whose sin is not mortal. There is sin that is mortal; I do not say that you should pray about that. (1 John 5:16)

    This seems to imply that there are in fact degrees to sin, with some sins being mortal (i.e. leading to death) while others are not.  I was wondering what people's thoughts were regarding this verse.
  • jydeaconjydeacon
    Well, i think what he is possibly saying is that all sins lead to death but if you see that your friend or whatever is repenting then pray for him that he may be forgiven, and if you see a friend that is not repenting stay away from him that you may not be pulled into this sin aswell, i may have completely misunderstood this verse but those are my thoughts,
    Ophadece,
    I believe that all will be judged on Judgement day not only the unfaithful, and if anything i believe he will judge the faithful more harshly because they sinned while in the faith knowing very well that what they are doing is wrong, and when St. Paul says faithful, i am thinking he means those who keep his commandments and have repented and are worthy (even though no one truly is) to enter the kingdom of heaven.
  • ophadeceophadece
    Dear jydeacon,
    Thanks for the clarification. If I come across to the verse that I thought made me inclined to have thought so in the first place, I will let you know. I still can't grasp the different degrees of sin though. So please help me with this as well if you don't mind.
    Dear Cephas,
    In addition to what jydeacon pointed out, I think the mortal sin also refers to blasphemy on the Holy Spirit (which in other words sins I am not repenting from). Hope that makes sense.
    God bless you all and pray for us a lot
  • jydeaconjydeacon
    Ophadece,
    when someone commits a sin no matter what it is in God's eyes it is a seperation from him as you said, but you cannot compare cursing to committing adultery or murdering someone, that is why when you confess certain sins abouna will posibbly tell you do a certain number of metanoias for such and such or different exercises or possibly telling you not to take communion for a certain period of time to sort of purge yourself(for a lack of a better word). that can even be seen with in the judicial system, the judge will not condem a man to life in prison for stealing a chocolate bar, i think more or less the degree of the sin might come with the punishment for it because certainly you cannot compare the degree of punishment of even the worst sins to what the devil will recieve, if you don't repent for it. does that make anysense or did i just ramble on? hopefully i helped
  • Anglican
    [quote author=Κηφᾶς link=topic=5988.msg80011#msg80011 date=1196863645]
    [coptic]+ Iryny nem `hmot>[/coptic]

    Regarding the notion of different degrees of sin, I had always thought that in the eyes of God, all sins are the same.  The wage of all sin is, afterall, death, as Paul teaches us.  However, I have just recently finished reading the Epistles of John, and came across the following passage:

    If you see your brother or sister committing what is not a mortal sin, you will ask, and God will give life to such a one-- to those whose sin is not mortal. There is sin that is mortal; I do not say that you should pray about that. (1 John 5:16)

    This seems to imply that there are in fact degrees to sin, with some sins being mortal (i.e. leading to death) while others are not.  I was wondering what people's thoughts were regarding this verse.


    Dear Κηφᾶς,

    Interesting you should quote St. John. His epistles are, I often think, the most pastoral of the epistles, and I am put in mind of the story told, I think, by St. Irenaeus that in old age the blessed saint would be carried into Church and, when asked for his counsel, he would say 'little children love one another!' I think that his where his wise counsel here comes from.

    He does see a difference of degree in types of sin, although all are displeasing to God and harmful to us. It is not that he thinks that osme sins are OK really, it is that he thinks that some are amenable to our prayer whilst others need something more.

    In Christ,

    Anglian
  • f753789f753789
    i am learning soo much!!..thanx every1

    i am not sure about the different degrees of sin either..i agree with both sides of the argument to a certain extent but i am not sure of the Truth..both sides pose logical reasons..if anyone knows pls post to inform us..thanx

    and about God judging differently...i dont know..i dont think that is the case b/c God will judge u on what u learned....however we cant use the excuse of ignorance in front of God...(lazurus the begger and the rich man in the Bible)..when the rich man wanted to return to earth and to inform his family to live a good life with God..God told him  no they have the books and everything..

    anyways God has a just judgement...look at Romans 1:32 and Romans 2:12..it kinda talks about Gods judgement

    ophadece..r u talking about Romans ch5:1?(the verse ur looking for)

    keep me in ur prayers
    -sister in Christ
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