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Revelation 17:8 Pre-destiny?

ZakharyZakhary
edited March 2008 in Faith Issues
I was reading in revelations and then verse 17:8 hit me when I saw:"The inhabitants of the earth whose names have not been written in the book of life from the creation of the world will be astonished"

I know God is fair and gives a chance to every one, but is that verse saying that my name is either written in the book of life before creation (allowing me to go to heaven) or it is not.  Does that mean that God planned where every body is going even before they were created? Wouldn't that make God kinda biased?

Please somebody clarify that verse for me,
Thanks

Comments

  • Unknown
    I think this might be a miscommunication, so what about all those saints, their names aren't written in the Bible, the modern ones, I'm not talking about St. Mary, St. John or St. Paul etc!! I hope I explained myself enough!!

    Forever,
    Coptic Servent
  • ZakharyZakhary
    I am not sure if St. John is talking about the Bible because in Revelation 20:12 he wrote: "And another book was opened, which is the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to their works, by the things which were written in the books."

    But then in another place (17:8 and 13:8 ) he says that the book was written before the foundation of the world.  So that's what is confusing me
  • Unknown
    Doesn't God know your future before anything happens... even if you're going to hell, but he has to give you a chance.. it's his duty.
    But I've never really understood how you can change when only God knows it... but that's a good question.
  • coptic pharoahcoptic pharoah
    I yhink God knows about everything u will do...when u will die, every detail of ur life even before u r born
    correct me if i am wrong plz
  • jydeaconjydeacon
    We DO NOT believe in pre-destination, we decide our fate, God just knows who will make and who won't.  When the book is saying written before the foundation of the world, its just saying God knows what will happen to us, because God is beyond time, he see's the past, present, and future happening all at once.
  • Unknown
    Pre-destination is a protestant idea started by John Calvin who believed that man is born and no matter what he does he is already per-destined. He believed in the elected being the chosen to go to heaven. He didn't know however who were the elected but thought and believed that he was an elected.
            That is a little history but here is the difference between this and pre-destination. The idea of Gods knowledge is not to be confused with pre-destination, because in Gods judgement it is by your faith, and by your works and of course other things which we as Christians have obligations for. The idea of pre-destination has nothing to do with that it is that you are destined and no matter what you do you are going where God has already placed you.
          To answer the original question if God didn't know the future then how would he be different from us humans, and how would he be all knowledgable that he doesn't know the future. If God didn't know the future there is your problem, but God being biased GOD-FORBID. God leaves it up to man but he still know what will happen to him. This topic explains the knowledge of God being different from the will of man : http://tasbeha.org/content/community/index.php?topic=6299.0
  • ZakharyZakhary
    I know that man's will determine his fate, no question.  But what these verses are saying is that my will is predermined by a book that was written millions of years before I was ever thought of
  • jydeaconjydeacon
    Your will was not pre-dermined it was just known
  • Unknown
    EXACTLY  ;)
            I am in full agreement with jydeacon, because just because your will is known means that is already planned for you but it is still YOUR will, and God would never take away mans free will.
  • ZakharyZakhary
    I am not arguing for pre destination, nor am I disagreeing with you.  But still, if for instance my name was not written in the book of life, would I be condemned to go to hades no matter how many good things I am doing right now?

    That's a pretty scary thought, at least for me
  • Unknown
    you'd only be condemned if you were to make bad decisions, and since you said it yourself you were doing good things, I can see no evidence of you being condemned!!

    Forever,
    coptic servent
  • Unknown
    What you are saying is a fight by the devil. The point is to get you in dispair. Guess what no matter what you do you can nver get yourself into the book of life, we recieved it as a gift from God. So you do your part and let God work, no one knows what or who is written in the book of life not even the angels, so why we try to worry ourselves, just think positively.  ;D
  • jydeaconjydeacon
    Your thinking in the wrong mentality which is putting you in despair, If you are doing great deeds then how can you think that you will not be in heaven? thats very wrong, and is exactly what predestination is saying that no matter what we do our fates are destined which is completely incorrect, if you do good deeds then you are for sure going to heaven. Your deeds are written in the book because God already knows whats going to happen but that does not mean  that no matter what you do that it doesn't matter.
  • duck
    [quote author=Zakhary link=topic=6344.msg83739#msg83739 date=1205466829]
    I am not arguing for pre destination, nor am I disagreeing with you.  But still, if for instance my name was not written in the book of life, would I be condemned to go to hades no matter how many good things I am doing right now?

    That's a pretty scary thought, at least for me


    Well lets flip this...maybe your name is written in the book of life, and no matter how many bad things your doing now...you will end up in heaven  ;D
  • PopeKyrillosPopeKyrillos
    [quote author=duck link=topic=6344.msg83760#msg83760 date=1205528015]
    [quote author=Zakhary link=topic=6344.msg83739#msg83739 date=1205466829]
    I am not arguing for pre destination, nor am I disagreeing with you.  But still, if for instance my name was not written in the book of life, would I be condemned to go to hades no matter how many good things I am doing right now?

    That's a pretty scary thought, at least for me


    Well lets flip this...maybe your name is written in the book of life, and no matter how many bad things your doing now...you will end up in heaven  ;D


    That's heretic, don't say that. That's what muslims think. If you're muslim, you go to heaven. Doesn't matter how bad you are. Of course, our church doesn't believe in that.
  • ZakharyZakhary
    In Exodus 32:31 Moses tells God "Oh, these people have committed a great sin, and have made for themselves a god of gold! 32 Yet now, if You will forgive their sin—but if not, I pray, blot me out of Your book which You have written.”

    So to continue the thought above, if your name is written in the book of life, then is it possible that God might delete your name from it?

    What if you do bad things as mentioned above?
  • Unknown
    That would not make sense at all to me. If God knows everything then he knows to write your name or not. There is no deleting because God answered Moses and said “Whoever has sinned against Me, I will blot him out of My book. 34 Now therefore, go, lead the people to the place of which I have spoken to you. Behold, My Angel shall go before you. Nevertheless, in the day when I visit for punishment, I will visit punishment upon them for their sin.”
           Realize that he said blot out meaning that his name won't be written never did he say anything about deleting. Also Moses's prayer was answered with a statement that was very wise because if Moses told him to take his name out that means that he knew his name was written to begin with. How would he know that, that is why God didn't answer with a no or a yes, so not to let Moses become arrogant, nor also be despaired.
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