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Sins
can the Coptic Orthodox church takaway your sins just like in the Roman Catholic church?
NESS<><
NESS<><
Comments
Sins are forgiven by confessing them to a priest or bishop and receiving absolution.
what about the priesthood of all belivers?
cant you confess your sins to God directly?
NESS<><
cant you confess your sins to God directly?
NESS<><
Of course not. Allow me to refer you to Matthew 18:18 for Biblical proof.
[quote author=NESS55 link=topic=7388.msg97781#msg97781 date=1228086770]
cant you confess your sins to God directly?
NESS<><
Of course not. Allow me to refer you to Matthew 18:18 for Biblical proof.
may i ask how does this passage explain i dint quite get it sry
NESS<><
So, when we get absolution, our sins are "loosed", so they are no longer remembered on Earth or in Heaven.
When our Lord says "Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven", he talking to the Apostles. As such, only them and their successors (the bishops, and therefore the priests), can forgive sins.
So, when we get absolution, our sins are "loosed", so they are no longer remembered on Earth or in Heaven.
One thing i just want to correct, is that the priest is not the one who is Forgiving sins but God who forgives through the priest. But as severus said, confession must go through a priest, its not acceptable to just confess to God, God already knows your sins He doesn't need you to confess to Him, You need to feel repentant and embarassed about what you did, which is what you should feel infront of the priest. If you are just saying I did this and this and this without feeling sorry or embarassed then whats the point?
One thing i just want to correct, is that the priest is not the one who is Forgiving sins but God who forgives through the priest. But as severus said, confession must go through a priest, its not acceptable to just confess to God, God already knows your sins He doesn't need you to confess to Him, You need to feel repentant and embarassed about what you did, which is what you should feel infront of the priest. If you are just saying I did this and this and this without feeling sorry or embarassed then whats the point?
yes i think this clears it up for me thank you however dont you feel embarresed by your sin anyway
NESS<><
One thing i just want to correct, is that the priest is not the one who is Forgiving sins but God who forgives through the priest. But as severus said, confession must go through a priest, its not acceptable to just confess to God, God already knows your sins He doesn't need you to confess to Him, You need to feel repentant and embarassed about what you did, which is what you should feel infront of the priest. If you are just saying I did this and this and this without feeling sorry or embarassed then whats the point?
yes i think this clears it up for me thank you however dont you feel embarresed by your sin anyway
NESS<><
well embarrassing is just a felling we get, but JUDGMENT of death on the Last Day, before GOD the Pantocrator and ALLLL people of heaven and earth, is what's really bad.
think about it!!!
dont you think that b/c the christian is saved there is no judgment for him b/c he has followed Christ? that judgment will be delt out only to the sinners
NESS<><
i agree with you maybe
dont you think that b/c the christian is saved there is no judgment for him b/c he has followed Christ? that judgment will be delt out only to the sinners
NESS<><
That's a laughable way of thinking, my friend. You are telling me that there is no accountability at all, then. You can say you followed Christ and live a life of rich indulgences and sins... and then not get judged?
i agree with you maybe
dont you think that b/c the christian is saved there is no judgment for him b/c he has followed Christ? that judgment will be delt out only to the sinners
NESS<><
i have to fully agree with Severus.
if you destroy "Judgment" you are destroying God's ability to JUDGE. then you are saying that God is Merciful (being granting us the way of salvation), but not Just (in being a judge, being the Creator and the Almighty ONE).
Also there are MANY verses that refer to this.
i agree with you maybe
dont you think that b/c the christian is saved there is no judgment for him b/c he has followed Christ? that judgment will be delt out only to the sinners
NESS<><
Hi Ness55,
I think this way of thinking is very Protestant. *Some* Protestants believe that just because they have faith, they are saved. But it's important for us to remember that faith without works is dead, which you can read about in the book of James.
"that judgement will be delt out only to the sinners"... We're all sinners ;-)
pray for me.
Hi Ness55,
I think this way of thinking is very Protestant. *Some* Protestants believe that just because they have faith, they are saved. But it's important for us to remember that faith without works is dead, which you can read about in the book of James.
i have to say that this is a little bit farther then the famous issue of "faith and works". the belief here is that THERE IS NO JUDGMENT. meaning that you can even work and have faith, and FULLY EXPECT no more judgment.
Are the sins of protestant people forgiven if they don't confess to priests?
Clearly, no.
Foremost, they don't partake of Christ's body and blood. Confession comes second.
[quote author=QT_PA_2T link=topic=7388.msg97810#msg97810 date=1228100221]
Are the sins of protestant people forgiven if they don't confess to priests?
Clearly, no.
Wow, Severus, forgive me, but I think your answer was just a tad bit too conclusive for a mere human being. I think only God can give that kind of definitive answer...
Forgive me
God bless
Please pray for my weakness
[quote author=Severus link=topic=7388.msg97811#msg97811 date=1228100603]
[quote author=QT_PA_2T link=topic=7388.msg97810#msg97810 date=1228100221]
Are the sins of protestant people forgiven if they don't confess to priests?
Clearly, no.
Wow, Severus, forgive me, but I think your answer was just a tad bit too conclusive for a mere human being. I think only God can give that kind of definitive answer...
Forgive me
God bless
Please pray for my weakness
his answer is based upon our belief as Orthodox believers. yes....God is the ultimate judge....but also HIS own words are what we live by and judge with.....even if it is, excuse me when i say this, against GOD HIMSELF. If God says do this and i will give you this, and you as a human being TRULY did it from all your heart, in every good possible way, then how can GOD contradict HIMSELF.
our father Abraham argued with God for the number of righteous people that were in Sodom and Gamorah to save the cities from destruction. He argued with HIM on the bases of how MERCIFUL HE was and how just int he same time.
Many other stories are in the BIble about this that shows how humans speak to God and make sure that they get their wage.
Didn't Elija asked God about how the widow's son died, whom GOD HIMSELF sent him to.
This is the same as the concept of asking God what we really need. God wants us to talk and pray to Him at all times.
And to show HIM that we, as believers i HIM, know our rights HE HIMSELF gave us.
[quote author=Severus link=topic=7388.msg97811#msg97811 date=1228100603]
[quote author=QT_PA_2T link=topic=7388.msg97810#msg97810 date=1228100221]
Are the sins of protestant people forgiven if they don't confess to priests?
Clearly, no.
Wow, Severus, forgive me, but I think your answer was just a tad bit too conclusive for a mere human being. I think only God can give that kind of definitive answer...
Forgive me
God bless
Please pray for my weakness
it is clear stated in the Bible:
John 6
55 For My flesh is food indeed, and My blood is drink indeed. 56 He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood abides in Me, and I in him.
Also I would like to add, it's impossible or at least nearly impossible to confess ALL your sins to the priest, you're bound to forget some, or maybe you commit a sin without even knowing...
and it is because of this fact that we pray for the dead (according to what I heard from HG Bishop Roufael) for God to forgive them those sins
so to say that all sins not confessed to a priest are not forgiven, even in the teachings of our own church should not be taken too literally
yes, we should strive to confess all, but when we don't for the mentioned reasons, it doens't mean we'll be going to hell
God bless you
Please pray for my weakness
Yes, but it doesn't say that those who don't will all go to hell, in any case, I just commented on the conclusive answer of NO, THEY WON'T BE FORGIVEN it is not up to us to say that, we can't take God's place, He's the only one who can judge. We should worry about our own salvation, and about whether we are abiding by the teachings of our most beloved church and strive for forgiveness for our sins
again, and agian, I SAY IT, "JUDGING IS NOT A SIN". we all do it when we know we are not.
ALso we are not taking GOD's place....we are just considering what HE HIMSELF promised us. How would GOD be considered in your belief if HE doesn't do what HE promised? well, that's why you should go and READ and understnad ALL the absolutions we have in our Church that the priest prays on the confessor, on himself, on ALL the people during liturgy in more then one time....even couple of minutes before communion.
but that's when God's mercy is fulfilled.
WE ARE NOT JUDGING EVERY PERSON'S sin here, we are speaking in general. we do to, you should read and understand the absolution(s) that are prayed on the soul of the departed. well yes. but go back tot he question of Qt:
[quote author=QT_PA_2T link=topic=7388.msg97810#msg97810 date=1228100221]
Are the sins of protestant people forgiven if they don't confess to priests?
he didn't say the "sins they don't confess"!!! he referred to NOT CONFESSING in general.
I think it's good to confess the main ones, like ' i am impatient' (and maybe give an example) rather than listing all the 25 people you've been impatient with in the past few weeks. what does anyone else think about that?
the way one excellent priest explained confession to some of us was that it's like a mentor listening to a person's weaknesses and then, knowing that person well, giving him or her ways of avoiding it. for example if someone is tempted by looking at his/her beautiful neighbour when praying, they should go in another room without a window, or if someone is gossiping, they should memorise some Bible verses to stop them being lazy and having time to gossip. this is the origin of what the Catholics developed as 'penance', the things the priest gives you to do should not be punishments to 'pay for' your sin, only Christ can pay for your sin, but they should be good discipline to stop you falling into sin again.
i think that confessing your sins to a priest is the natural interpretation of those two Bible verses (Jesus giving Peter the keys to the kingdom of heaven, and the verse that says 'confess your sins to one another and pray for one another and you shall be healed'). i understand that some Christians think that it's not necessary to confess sins to a priest, but if you don't have a priest, at the very least, you should make sure you confess you sins 'to one another' and especially don't hide anything. you know your hiding something if you keep breaking out into a sweat when someone asks about your spiritual life. if you hide something from your spiritual father, how can you possibly expect him to help you in your spiritual life?
i can really recommend confession. tell God as soon as you do something wrong and repent (and, yes, if you die on your way to confession i believe you will be forgiven) and then tell the priest and get some great advice and absolution
may God protect us all and forgive us sinners
i can really recommend confession. tell God as soon as you do something wrong and repent (and, yes, if you die on your way to confession i believe you will be forgiven) and then tell the priest and get some great advice and absolution
may God protect us all and forgive us sinners
hmmm....confession is not a "recommendation"....it is a "Sacrament" that all must fully and trully do with true repentance.
God bless u
sure, minagir, i'm trying to explain it to the non-orthodox so they see it what way it's valuable.
God bless u
well it wouldn't sound "valuable" if we ourselves are not giving it, the sacrament, it's own honor and respect!!!
i can't go around and twist my faith so a "non-orthodox" can come into the faith!!
please correct me if im wrong.
God bless you
Please pray for my weakness
Yes, but it doesn't say that those who don't will all go to hell, in any case, I just commented on the conclusive answer of NO, THEY WON'T BE FORGIVEN it is not up to us to say that, we can't take God's place, He's the only one who can judge. We should worry about our own salvation, and about whether we are abiding by the teachings of our most beloved church and strive for forgiveness for our sins
Also I would like to add, it's impossible or at least nearly impossible to confess ALL your sins to the priest, you're bound to forget some, or maybe you commit a sin without even knowing...
and it is because of this fact that we pray for the dead (according to what I heard from HG Bishop Roufael) for God to forgive them those sins
so to say that all sins not confessed to a priest are not forgiven, even in the teachings of our own church should not be taken too literally
yes, we should strive to confess all, but when we don't for the mentioned reasons, it doens't mean we'll be going to hell
God bless you
Please pray for my weakness
Then Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you."
-John 6:53
I agree with Dgorgy, I saw Mabsoota's post as very encouraging to anyone to go ahead and confess...
God bless you
Please pray for my weakness
to all you 3, CONFESS TO WHO??
and after confession, WHAT WILL HAPPEN??
of course these questions are as if you are telling a "non-Orthodox" to confess......