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Christ Commands That We Should Remember The Saints
In the commemoration of the saints, every liturgy, the priest says "as this O Lord is the COMMAND OF YOUR ONLY BEGOTTEN SON". Well, where exactly does Christ in the bible command us to remember them?
PK
P.S. I am in no way trying to degrade the saints or argue that Christ never said to remember them. It is just a matter of curiosity.
PK
P.S. I am in no way trying to degrade the saints or argue that Christ never said to remember them. It is just a matter of curiosity.
Comments
God bless
Please pray for my weakness
2 Thessalonians 1:11 - we always pray for you
2 Thessalonians 3:1 - finally, brothers, pray for us
1 Timothy 2:1-7 - offer prayers and petitions for all men
Ephesians 4:3 - pray for us
2 Thessalonians 1:11 - we always pray for you
2 Thessalonians 3:1 - finally, brothers, pray for us
From Church Fathers
St. Cyril
In 350 A.D., St. Cyril wrote a remarkable and exquisitely detailed description of the Mass, which clearly corresponds with today's Mass. In it we find this beautiful statement on
the family of God which we all belong to, and which even today we pray for in every Mass: ":.. upon completion of the spiritual Sacrifice, the bloodless worship, over that propitiatory victim, we call upon God for the common peace of the Churches, for the welfare of the world, for kings, for soldiers and allies, for the sick, for the afflicted, and in summary, we all pray and offer this Sacrifice for all who are in need. Then we make mention also of those who have already fallen asleep: first, the patriarchs, prophets, apostles, and martyrs, that through their prayers and supplications God would receive our petition; next, we make mention also of the holy fathers and bishops who have already fallen asleep, and, to put it simply, of all among us who have already fallen asleep; for we believe that it will be of very great benefit to the souls of those for whom the petition is carried up, while this holy and most solemn Sacrifice is laid out.” (The Faith of the Early Fathers,' Vol. 1, William A. Jurgens, [Collegeville, Minnesota: Liturgical Press, 1970] p. 363.). The faithful in heaven and on earth are united in the Person of Jesus through the Sacrament of the Eucharist. This is the meaning of the Communion of Saints
Ephraim the Syrian
"You victorious martyrs who endured torments gladly for the sake of the God and Savior, you who have boldness of speech toward the Lord himself, you saints, intercede for us who are timid and sinful men, full of sloth, that the grace of Christ may come upon us, and enlighten the hearts of all of us so that we may love him"
Clement of Alexandria
"In this way is he [the true Christian] always pure for prayer. He also prays in the society of angels, as being already of angelic rank, and he is never out of their holy keeping; and though he pray alone, he has the choir of the saints standing with him [in prayer]"
Origen"But not the high priest [Christ] alone prays for those who pray sincerely, but also the angels . . . as also the souls of the saints who have already fallen asleep"
PK
Here are 2 verses from the NT.They are telling us what was commanded to them.
2 Corinthians 1:11 "Ye also helping together by prayer for us, that for the gift bestowed upon us by the means of many persons thanks may be given by many on our behalf"
Ephesians 6:18 "Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints"
Christ is the body of the church and they are part of that body in Christ.
Are you looking for a direct Qoute?
For example, on the way to Emmaus, the Lord explained to the two disciples how His coming was already fortold in the OT. His explanation is not literally mentioned, but somehow it got to us by tradition.
God Bless
Please pray for my weakness
PS it also just makes sence that all the members of the Body of Christ (who are all alive, whether in heaven or on earth should pray for eachother..)
There is the verse.. he who gives you only a cup of water because you belong to christ will by no means lose his reward.
And there is another verse.
but let us not think as the protestants do and disregard tradition which was handed down to us by the apostles themselves who had received them for Christ.
In my first post I mentioned the fact that I am not trying to degrade the saints or argue with the fact that Christ never said to remember them.
All these verses are great, but it still does not sound like a direct commandment. I was thinking that maybe Christ said something directly about remembering them in the Gospel. Anyways, thanks for your help.
PK
GBU
GBU
The commemoration of the saints is prayed in every liturgy (Sts. Basil, Gregory, and Cyril).
A Paragraph before that would be the last litany which is-
Priest:
Remember, O Lord, those who brought
unto You these oblations, those on
whose behalf they have been brought,
and those by whom they have been
brought. Give them all the heavenly
reward.
Deacon:
Pray for these holy and honored
oblations, our sacrifices and those who
have offered them.
Congregation:
Lord have mercy.
Then the priest prays the Commemoration of the Saints-
Priest:
As this, O Lord, is the command of Your
Only-begotten Son, that we share in the
commemoration of Your saints;
Graciously accord, O Lord, remember
all the saints, who have pleased You
since the beginning; Our holy fathers
the patriarchs, the prophets, the
apostles, the preachers, the
evangelists, the martyrs, the confessors
and all the spirits of the righteous who
were consummated in the faith.
The priest starts reciting the names of the saints starting first with the Virgin Mary. He then ends the Commemoration with-
And all the choir of Your saints,
through whose prayers and
supplications, have mercy on us all and
save us for the sake of Your Holy Name
which is called upon us.
PK
Dear friend,
Matthew 10 (King James Version)
40 He that receiveth you receiveth me, and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.
41 He that receiveth a prophet in the name of a prophet shall receive a prophet's reward; and he that receiveth a righteous man in the name of a righteous man shall receive a righteous man's reward.
42 And whosoever shall give to drink unto one of these little ones a cup of cold water only in the name of a disciple, verily I say unto you, he shall in no wise lose his reward.
John 17 (King James Version)
10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.
John 17 (King James Version)
22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:
John 17 (King James Version)
24 Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.
Matthew 19(King James Version)
28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
Psalm 82 (King James Version)
6I have said,Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.
John 14 (King James Version)
12 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go unto my Father.
Psalm 37(King James Version)
28 For the LORD loveth judgment, and forsaketh not his saints; they are preserved for ever: but the seed of the wicked shall be cut off.
Psalm 45(King James Version)
16 Instead of thy fathers shall be thy children, whom thou mayest make princes in all the earth.
17 I will make thy name to be remembered in all generations: therefore shall the people praise thee for ever and ever.
Psalm 48(King James Version)
12 Walk about Zion, and go round about her: tell the towers thereof.
13 Mark ye well her bulwarks, consider her palaces; that ye may tell it to the generation following.
Matthew 10(King James Version)
17 Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.
Matthew 10(King James Version)
14 Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.
John 15(King James Version)
8 Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.
John 15(King James Version)
16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.
Mark 12 (King James Version)
35 And Jesus answered and said, while he taught in the temple, How say the scribes that Christ is the son of David?
36 For David himself said by the Holy Ghost, The LORD said to my Lord, Sit thou on my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool.
37 David therefore himself calleth him Lord; and whence is he then his son? And the common people heard him gladly.
If the only begotten, The Son of God, The Lord, Jesus The Christ has used st. David's psalms, how much we need to use the words of the greatest desciple st. Paul ?
The whole Bible is the word of God. Nothing is written out of God's consent.
May God be with us with His holiest mother, holy angels, saints in love and mercy. Amen!!!
I also found something interesting on this subject:
.......... (reference below)
Another meditation on the importance of the Commemoration of the Saints and the
Doxologies comes from H.G. Bishop Hedra of Aswan.
"Proceeding these hymns is the commemoration of the saints. When we have become
involved in praising God and glorifying Him, we have the participation of the
victorious church with us. It is the souls of the saints who have preceded us to the
paradise of joy, that come to support us and to accompany us in our continuous
struggle against the world, sin, and the weaknesses of the body. So we ask from their
love and their aid to remember us before the Throne of blessing with a stronger
intercession. So we say, "Intercede (or pray) on our behalf that the Lord may forgive
us our sins." This last phrase makes us feel how sinful we are that we may learn the
life of humility. It is also a deep theological order in our Coptic Orthodox Church,
which teaches us the intercession and prayers of the saints. We also notice the
difference between an intercession and a prayer request. The intercession is specified
for Saint Mary, the heavenly hosts, John the Baptist, and the 144,000 martyrs. This
is due to the high level at which they are and because they have special favor before
God. The prayer request is specified for the rest of the martyrs and the saints."
As Bishop Hedra explained, the mentioning of the saints is a means to humble
ourselves. It is only when we humble ourselves, realizing that we have not lived a
strong Christian life, that we become closer to God. We also learn the difference
between intercessions and prayer requests, once again learning more about the
theology of the Church as we sing the hymns of the Church.
A final reason why we sing the Commemoration of the Saints and the Doxologies is
to fulfill the commandment of our Lord Jesus Christ. When the Lord sat with his
disciples, a woman came with very costly oil to anoint Jesus with it. She was rebuked
by Jesus’ disciples, who thought she should have sold it and given the money to the
poor. But Jesus answered and said,
"Assuredly, I say to you, wherever this gospel is preached in the whole world, what
this woman has done will be also told as a memorial to her" (Matthew 26:13).
The saints, who loved the Lord with all their heart, who offered sweet repentance
before Him and who died for Him, who not only anointed His feet, but proclaimed
His word throughout the world, confessing His Glory, should they not also be told to
the believers and non-believers as a memorial to them?
"Can the lover of martyrs ever have enough of their memory? The honor given to the
righteous, our fellow servants, is a testimony of the good will of our Common Master.
Bless the martyrs heartily, that you may be a martyr by intention. Thus, even though
you depart this life without persecutor, fire or lash, you will still be found worthy of
the same reward" (St. Basil the Great).
Reference:
IN THE NAME OF GOD, ALMIGHTY
COPTIC ORTHODOX PATRIARCHATE
ST. MARK'S COPTIC ORTHODOX CHURCH
TORONTO, CANADA
The Spirituality of the Holy Psalmody
Edited and Forword by H.G. Bishop Youssef
Bishop of the Diocese of the Southern United States
Written by Matthew Massoud
St. Mark's Coptic Orthodox Church
41 Glendenning Ave.
Agincourt, Ontario
M1W 3E2
Canada
(416) 494-4449
* Hard copies of this book may be ordered from the address and phone number
above (ask for Fr. Pishoy Salama), or by contacting Matthew Massoud at
* [email protected] *
* All quotes from the Holy Bible in this article are taken from the New King James Version *
Forward of book
Praise is the work of the angels standing before the throne of God praising Him
incessantly. The Holy Psalmody is a means for praise, prayer, thanksgiving,
glorification, and appeal to God.
This book gives us a brief historical overview of the Psalmody, its biblical origin, and
the sayings of the fathers concerning singing hymns, especially the Psalms. It takes us
on a spiritual journey of meditation to uncover the meaning, beauty and the
spirituality behind each part of the Sunday Psalmody.
The book invites us to arise, as the first hymn in the Psalmody, ‘Tentheno’ or ‘Arise’,
is a call for all the believers to awake from both their physical and spiritual sleep to
praise the Lord. It encourages us in the First Canticle to join together in praising the
Lord and to lead a life of repentance, as it recounts the crossing of the Red Sea
symbolizing the baptism to get to a new life of repentance.
The Second Canticle brings to light the life of Thanksgiving beginning by giving
thanks to the Lord, professing His glory, and the perfection of His creation. We are
then brought to the point of persecution in the Third Canticle. The devil has seen
the strength of the Lord, and our journey to salvation, and begins to send his hosts of
demons to destroy us. The Three Youths bring to light the true life of Christianity
and the endurance through trials and tribulations. The persecution leads us to the
commemoration of the saints where we begin to mention the names of those in
paradise who were able to "fight the good fight." The author meditates on the
importance and dogma of the intercessions of the saints then gives us a taste of
heaven as we pray the Fourth Canticle with all the choirs of the heavens, praising our
awesome and powerful God as He sits on His throne.
Now that we have tasted heaven, let us go forth and fight for it. We have to seek
repentance and humility because these are the keys to heaven. The author leads us to
the Psali of the Holy Psalmody (the Jesus Prayer) through which we ask ceaselessly
"My Lord Jesus help me." By singing and meditating on His name throughout the
Holy Psalmody, especially in the Sunday Psali for Jesus, we are not only raised, but
we destroy the devil as we sing His name.
The author then guides us through the Sunday Theotokia, meditating not only on the
symbol of St. Mary but also on her life of humility and service being the highest saint
of heaven, and the perfect model of Christianity. The Sunday Theotokia ends with
the hymn Aven Piarshi-Eirevs which provides a wonderful image to the believer
concerning the death of our Lord Jesus Christ on the Cross.
From my heart I deeply thank the author for his great effort in researching this topic.
May this book be a blessing to those who read it so that they may savor the richness
of the Holy Psalmody and praise the Lord with understanding, with humility and with
joy through the intercession of St. Mary the mother of God, the prayers of all the
saints, and through the prayers of our beloved father H.H. Pope Shenouda III.
Glory be to God forever. Amen.
Bishop Youssef
Bishop, Coptic Orthodox Diocese of the Southern US
17th of Babah, 1720 A.M. – 28th of October, 2003
ebook (PDF) is online - better buy it if you can it's a very good one to have
http://christville.net/index2.php?option=com_docman&task=doc_view&gid=22&Itemid=27
very costly oil=NARDINE! (warmth of faith, spiritual fire in the believer's heart)
John 2
17 Then His disciples remembered that it was written, “Zeal for Your house has eaten Me up.”
Luke 24
30 Now it came to pass, as He sat at the table with them, that He took bread, blessed and broke it, and gave it to them. 31 Then their eyes were opened and they knew Him; and He vanished from their sight.
32 And they said to one another, “Did not our heart burn within us while He talked with us on the road, and while He opened the Scriptures to us?” 33 So they rose up that very hour and returned to Jerusalem, and found the eleven and those who were with them gathered together, 34 saying, “The Lord is risen indeed, and has appeared to Simon!” 35 And they told about the things that had happened on the road, and how He was known to them in the breaking of bread.
GBU
also as Godislove mentioned... there are many teachings that were oral... our Lord taught the apostles how to perform the sacrament...
also in Revelation...
"Then another angel, having a golden censer, came and stood at the altar. He was given much incense, that he should offer it with the prayers of all the saints upon the golden altar which was before the throne. And the smoke of the incense, with the prayers of the saints, ascended before God from the angel’s hand."
"Now when He had taken the scroll, the four living creatures and the twenty-four elders fell down before the Lamb, each having a harp, and golden bowls full of incense, which are the prayers of the saints."
also on this note... let us remember that every saint that is mentioned comes right on that altar...
akhadna el baraka... neshkor Allah!
sdfs
the mother of samuel
or the mother of mina
she is more than satisfied and pleased that people remember who her children were..... and dosnt think or care that no one remembers her name
she is Just that simple to be happy to be called the mother of mina or the mother of samuel
Just the same the lord Jesus is the mother and father of the Church and christianity
and he loves when we praise and remember his children the saints of our church
I agree with what you have shared
we should acept the bible for what it is
who are we to question it
Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to all!
The Scriptures themselves teach how important it is to remember the Saints. Since the Holy Bible says this then the Most Holy Trinity does as well. This is a very brief and not at all concise explanation so please do not consider it a profound explanation.
The Church is the family of God and like every family, we remember those members who have passed on. The difference being a biological family remembers deceased relatives who they believe will never be see again (not if they're Christians) and our spiritual family remember 'relatives' who live on with Christ. All who baptized in Christ and live in His Church are risen in Christ: 37 But even Moses showed in the burning bush passage that the dead are raised, when [glow=red,2,300]he called the Lord ‘the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.’[a] 38 For He is not the God of the dead but of the living, for all live to Him.” [/glow] Thus in the Bodyof Christ-the Church- death has been defeated because Christ has risen from the dead, trampling down death by death and to those in the tombs, bestowing life.
The Church is called Mt. Zion and the city of the living God:
"22 But you have come to [glow=red,2,300]Mount Zion and to the city of the living God,[/glow] the heavenly Jerusalem, to an innumerable company of angels, 23 to the general assembly and church of the firstborn who are registered in heaven, to God the Judge of all, to the spirits of just men made perfect, 24 to Jesus the Mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling that speaks better things than that of Abel."
Thus our God is the living, not of the dead (spiritually dead). Is the Church- the Mystical Body of Christ- comprised only of those on earth? Has death separated us from the love of God? Heck no! St. Paul tells us in Romans 8:37-39:
37 Yet in all these things we are more than conquerors through Him who loved us. 38 For I am persuaded that neither death nor life, nor angels nor principalities nor powers, nor things present nor things to come, 39 nor height nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
What was our Lord's answer when asked which was the greatest commandment? He said:(Matthew 22:37-39)
‘You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind.This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like it: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.
and:
"34 A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another; as I have loved you, that you also love one another (John13:34)."
Thus when you ask someone to pray for you their prayerful response is a manifestation of this commandment. Many individuals limit their family by only remembering the living which is a bit sad, since families are much bigger than just who we know.
Earlier on I typed a very biblical response to this question and thne accidently erased it! Duh! One day the Holy Spirit will help me remember it so i can post it..lol!