???In Sunday School, the teacher told us Paradise and Heaven are two different things. She said Paradise is a waiting place, which I thought Abraham's prison was. She also said Heaven is where we go after Jesus' Second Coming. Can someone please clarify this for me? ???
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Paradise is a waiting place, like a lobby. Except, its not like purgatory in the sence that there are no chance to be had, your either in or your not. In purgatory, you have a chance to fix your mistake. With the notion of paradise, its that or hell. We will all go to heaven, when Christ "opens the gates of heaven to those that await him" after the second coming. So, don't be confused, Ill try to find some text that may offer more clarification.
When Jesus spoke to the theif on the right hand side, he said today you will be with me in paradise.
We either go to paradise or hades, after judgement day, we either go to heaven or hell.
My understanding is that to be in heaven (in the copitc church) you must be sinless. Only on judgement day will we be in heaven.
Which actually brings me to a different point in wondering, why we believe that Mary's body physically ascended into heaven, yet we don't believe she's sinless, for in order to be in heaven, you must be sinless (as Catholics beleive)???
I'm Coptic (and completely believe in our faith) but I've never had a satisfactory answer to this question.
Maybe I'm misunderstanding this too, but how can one go to a good or bad place without having first been judged? That's where I'm confused. It would seem to me that if i'm in Hades, its pretty certain that I'm on my way to Hell, which is probably where i"m going for continuing this subject... But it truly is a point of confusion for me. I guess we'll never really know until we die...
"And Jesus said to him, "Assuredly, I say to you, today you will be with Me in Paradise." Luke 23:43
"He answered and said to them, "Because it has been given to you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given. " Matthew13:11
so it's more that Paradise is the immediate gift we recieve after death, until we wait for the world to end and for our eternal lives to begin, whose mysteries were given to us, yet not revealed. Heaven is spoken of as a kingdom we inherit.. and i figure that we can't all inherit our part until we're all together in one place to be given to accordingly... right?
I would like to try to analyse your question and find an answer for it.
why we believe that Mary's body physically ascended into heaven, yet we don't believe she's sinless, for in order to be in heaven, you must be sinless (as Catholics beleive)???
1-It's completely true the fact that we must be sinless in order to be in heaven
2-I'm not able to be sinless. what do you think I don't have any chance to go to heaven (the happy eternal life)?
The answer is I have a strong hope to go there
Do you know why?
because I can wash my clothes in the blood of Our lod and savior Jesus Christ (Rv 7)
How can I do this? you know of course,I'm sure
God by his crusifixion and resurrection pured all myself my soul and my body
So pleased are st.Mary who washed herself in the blood of our Lord to be a role model for us.
the last point I'd like to add the church fathers teach us that our bodies will be glorious in the next coming (similar to our lord's body after his reserrction)
Do you please pray for me to be worthy to go to heaven?
peace and love from our Lord be with you
I will try to answer your question.
[quote author=kokig link=board=1;threadid=205;start=0#msg995 date=1083121155]
Here's the other question.... If its true, that we all go to "waiting places" and one is supposedly a "good" waiting place, and one is a "bad" waiting place doesn't that imply that once a person dies, he's already been judged? And doesn't that conflict with our Creed... "...and He [Jesus] is comming in glory to judge the living and the dead whose Kingdom shall have no end....."
Maybe I'm misunderstanding this too, but how can one go to a good or bad place without having first been judged? That's where I'm confused.
After a person dies, he knows exactly before judgement where will be his eternal place either Heaven or Hell and goes to Paradise or Hadis accordingly. So what is the use of judgement? Judgement is to classify people in Heaven and Hell. Because 2 people may go together to Heaven but they will have different ranks according to their acts. So the purpose of judgement is not to know if the person is going to Heaven or Hell because he already knows it in advance after his death but to find out his position in Heaven or Hell.
I hope I answered your question
Thank you and pray for me.
KF
From the parable of the rich and Lazarus in Luke 16:19-31. As soon as Lazarus died, he went to Abraham’s bosom and as soon as the rich died he went to Hadis. This is not after judgement day but before because the rich brothers were still living on Earth. We can find that in Luke 16:27-28.
May God allow all of us to go to Paradise after our death and then Heaven.
Thank you and pray for me.
KF
I found a wonderful explanation from a coptic priest online: http://www.suscopts.org/q&a/h.html#qhad1
It is very detailed and Biblical so enjoy! Also i will like to help clarify a misconception concerning the Roman Catholic innovation called Purgatory.
It is not another chance to go to heaven nor does a soul stay there for ever if they weren't too bad on earth. Acording to the Roman Catholic catechism: "1031 The Church gives the name Purgatory to this final purification of the elect, which is entirely different from the punishment of the damned. The Church formulated her doctrine of faith on Purgatory especially at the Councils of Florence and Trent. The tradition of the Church, by reference to certain texts of Scripture, speaks of a cleansing fire" According to their teaching, its temporary until the person is purified of their sinfulness (even though they already confessed it to a priest in the sacrament and were forgiven...the justice part of it is still owed to God...thus they have to do some "jailtime"...although roman catholics will not word it this way nowadays anymore). If a Roman Catholic says this is not true then ask them why is the word punishment used in their catechism concerning purgatory: "1475 In the communion of saints, "a perennial link of charity exists between the faithful who have already reached their heavenly home, those who are expiating their sins in purgatory and those who are still pilgrims on earth. between them there is, too, an abundant exchange of all good things." In this wonderful exchange, the holiness of one profits others, well beyond the harm that the sin of one could cause others. Thus recourse to the communion of saints lets the contrite sinner be more promptly and efficaciously purified of the punishments for sin."
Any way just wanted to make sure proper information is given ...I am an ex Roman catholic. Gbu !http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc.htm