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IT REALLY FEELS WRONG!
Okay everyone, i just recently made a topic on kids in the altar but i think this next topic in my church is just WRONG, and its the preists fault. There are 4 priests at my church and NONE of them can see the problem with this and I can see that its incredibly wrong and i know many others see and cant even believe wut the priests are doing...
Okay so in my church there are 2 altars, the one in the middle, and theres one on the left side that is where the male deacons usually change if the mass thats taking place is on the middle altar. On sundays their is a morning mass and a mass that follows right after.. the one in the morning starts at 7 and ends at aproximately 9:45 to 10:00 than immediatly after the second mass begins, the one with the middle altar.... The way it works out is one priest will come in for the early mass and when its time for communion the second priest will come in and give out the blood while the first priest is giving out the body so that its faster...
Heres the problem... You know how when mass is over the priest talks about certain things like upcoming events in the church, or like trips to like egypt or w.e.... The oldest priest in our church Made a new rule... and that is BEFORE THE MASS IS COMPLETELY OVER HE WILL START TALKING..... what i mean by this is when the first priest has finished giving out communion and takes the body back to the altar, you know how the priests finished the body and blood himself or uses the deacons so help him finish every little bit... BEFORE HE IS DONE doing this the nex preists goes out and all the hymns stop and he starts talking about upcoming events and church info WHILE the priest in the altar is still NOT FINISHED EATING AND DRINKING THE BODY AND BLOOD... which means that their is still some of the body and blood that has not been consumed while the other priest stops the deacons from singing w.e song they may be singing and starts talking about how the church is going on this trip or wuts happening nex sunday or w.e, and the reason their doing this is so that they can start the next mass right away..... Isnt this completely wrong??? I mean the first time i saw this i couldnt believe it and i dont see how the priests are all fine with it... THE BODY AND BLOOD OF JESUS IS STILL PRESENT and there talking about church trips and how church day care or w.e.......is it just me or does anyone see that this is not right???
Okay so in my church there are 2 altars, the one in the middle, and theres one on the left side that is where the male deacons usually change if the mass thats taking place is on the middle altar. On sundays their is a morning mass and a mass that follows right after.. the one in the morning starts at 7 and ends at aproximately 9:45 to 10:00 than immediatly after the second mass begins, the one with the middle altar.... The way it works out is one priest will come in for the early mass and when its time for communion the second priest will come in and give out the blood while the first priest is giving out the body so that its faster...
Heres the problem... You know how when mass is over the priest talks about certain things like upcoming events in the church, or like trips to like egypt or w.e.... The oldest priest in our church Made a new rule... and that is BEFORE THE MASS IS COMPLETELY OVER HE WILL START TALKING..... what i mean by this is when the first priest has finished giving out communion and takes the body back to the altar, you know how the priests finished the body and blood himself or uses the deacons so help him finish every little bit... BEFORE HE IS DONE doing this the nex preists goes out and all the hymns stop and he starts talking about upcoming events and church info WHILE the priest in the altar is still NOT FINISHED EATING AND DRINKING THE BODY AND BLOOD... which means that their is still some of the body and blood that has not been consumed while the other priest stops the deacons from singing w.e song they may be singing and starts talking about how the church is going on this trip or wuts happening nex sunday or w.e, and the reason their doing this is so that they can start the next mass right away..... Isnt this completely wrong??? I mean the first time i saw this i couldnt believe it and i dont see how the priests are all fine with it... THE BODY AND BLOOD OF JESUS IS STILL PRESENT and there talking about church trips and how church day care or w.e.......is it just me or does anyone see that this is not right???
Comments
Another thing is that if the priest didn't pray the liturgy then he probably shouldn't be distributing the body or blood.
he can give out the blood. there is nothing wrong with that.
Okay everyone, i just recently made a topic on kids in the altar but i think this next topic in my church is just WRONG, and its the preists fault. There are 4 priests at my church and NONE of them can see the problem with this and I can see that its incredibly wrong and i know many others see and cant even believe wut the priests are doing...
Okay so in my church there are 2 altars, the one in the middle, and theres one on the left side that is where the male deacons usually change if the mass thats taking place is on the middle altar. On sundays their is a morning mass and a mass that follows right after.. the one in the morning starts at 7 and ends at aproximately 9:45 to 10:00 than immediatly after the second mass begins, the one with the middle altar.... The way it works out is one priest will come in for the early mass and when its time for communion the second priest will come in and give out the blood while the first priest is giving out the body so that its faster...
Heres the problem... You know how when mass is over the priest talks about certain things like upcoming events in the church, or like trips to like egypt or w.e.... The oldest priest in our church Made a new rule... and that is BEFORE THE MASS IS COMPLETELY OVER HE WILL START TALKING..... what i mean by this is when the first priest has finished giving out communion and takes the body back to the altar, you know how the priests finished the body and blood himself or uses the deacons so help him finish every little bit... BEFORE HE IS DONE doing this the nex preists goes out and all the hymns stop and he starts talking about upcoming events and church info WHILE the priest in the altar is still NOT FINISHED EATING AND DRINKING THE BODY AND BLOOD... which means that their is still some of the body and blood that has not been consumed while the other priest stops the deacons from singing w.e song they may be singing and starts talking about how the church is going on this trip or wuts happening nex sunday or w.e, and the reason their doing this is so that they can start the next mass right away..... Isnt this completely wrong??? I mean the first time i saw this i couldnt believe it and i dont see how the priests are all fine with it... THE BODY AND BLOOD OF JESUS IS STILL PRESENT and there talking about church trips and how church day care or w.e.......is it just me or does anyone see that this is not right???
no it's not wrong. it's the responsiblity of the priest to tell the ppl about the services of the church. that is of the church which is Jesus Christ who's Body is on the Altar. so there is nothing wrong. what's wrong is when ppl talk, sit down and leave early after taking communion.
[quote author=PopeKyrillos link=topic=6247.msg82441#msg82441 date=1203444359]
Yes, For sure this is wrong. Abouna Shenouda from Chicago got excommunicated for making announcements during the liturgy. However, there is nothing you can do about it. I wouldn't reccomend talking to the priest about this. That would be kind of disrespectful.
watch what you are saying......If this is Fr. Shenouda of Abba Bishoy's, than this is wrong. becuase the word "excommunicated" is very strong and did not happend. if it did, he wouldn't be praying liturgies in East Brunswick.
[quote author=PopeKyrillos link=topic=6247.msg82442#msg82442 date=1203444476]
Another thing is that if the priest didn't pray the liturgy then he probably shouldn't be distributing the body or blood.
NO it's not wrong. a preist can come and help in communion. He just wont be able to do the other things like the other priests who served. because he wouldn't be fasting so he's can't drink from the cup and the most he would do is wash his hand after finishing.
[quote author=His Servant link=topic=6247.msg82452#msg82452 date=1203456409]
hold on i think were mixed up i think im talking about a sermon and your talking about announcments. that i understand. but during the sermon can't abouna close the curtain so that everyone sits down?
hard to control ppl while that, and if there is a sermon, you know ppl are mostly not listening....except if it was a nice qiuck liturgy.
[quote author=Meena_Ameen link=topic=6247.msg82451#msg82451 date=1203456138]
I dont want to disrespect the priest as Pope Kyrollos said, but even worse is i dont want Jesus to be disrespected like that.. I mean for the Lord to give us his own BODY and BLOOD and for us to treat it like its just not THAT great is the most disrespectfull thing... Even if there are a few crumbs left that havent been consumed, that should still be enough for everyone to be silent in its presence and the only talking should be the singing of hymns glorifying God.
ya habibi you are not disrespecting the Body and Blood at all. this things are part of church matters, nothing wrong with that.
[quote author=Meena_Ameen link=topic=6247.msg82440#msg82440 date=1203444091]
Okay everyone, i just recently made a topic on kids in the altar but i think this next topic in my church is just WRONG, and its the preists fault. There are 4 priests at my church and NONE of them can see the problem with this and I can see that its incredibly wrong and i know many others see and cant even believe wut the priests are doing...
Okay so in my church there are 2 altars, the one in the middle, and theres one on the left side that is where the male deacons usually change if the mass thats taking place is on the middle altar. On sundays their is a morning mass and a mass that follows right after.. the one in the morning starts at 7 and ends at aproximately 9:45 to 10:00 than immediatly after the second mass begins, the one with the middle altar.... The way it works out is one priest will come in for the early mass and when its time for communion the second priest will come in and give out the blood while the first priest is giving out the body so that its faster...
Heres the problem... You know how when mass is over the priest talks about certain things like upcoming events in the church, or like trips to like egypt or w.e.... The oldest priest in our church Made a new rule... and that is BEFORE THE MASS IS COMPLETELY OVER HE WILL START TALKING..... what i mean by this is when the first priest has finished giving out communion and takes the body back to the altar, you know how the priests finished the body and blood himself or uses the deacons so help him finish every little bit... BEFORE HE IS DONE doing this the nex preists goes out and all the hymns stop and he starts talking about upcoming events and church info WHILE the priest in the altar is still NOT FINISHED EATING AND DRINKING THE BODY AND BLOOD... which means that their is still some of the body and blood that has not been consumed while the other priest stops the deacons from singing w.e song they may be singing and starts talking about how the church is going on this trip or wuts happening nex sunday or w.e, and the reason their doing this is so that they can start the next mass right away..... Isnt this completely wrong??? I mean the first time i saw this i couldnt believe it and i dont see how the priests are all fine with it... THE BODY AND BLOOD OF JESUS IS STILL PRESENT and there talking about church trips and how church day care or w.e.......is it just me or does anyone see that this is not right???
no it's not wrong. it's the responsiblity of the priest to tell the ppl about the services of the church. that is of the church which is Jesus Christ who's Body is on the Altar. so there is nothing wrong. what's wrong is when ppl talk, sit down and leave early after taking communion.
[quote author=PopeKyrillos link=topic=6247.msg82441#msg82441 date=1203444359]
Yes, For sure this is wrong. Abouna Shenouda from Chicago got excommunicated for making announcements during the liturgy. However, there is nothing you can do about it. I wouldn't reccomend talking to the priest about this. That would be kind of disrespectful.
watch what you are saying......If this is Fr. Shenouda of Abba Bishoy's, than this is wrong. becuase the word "excommunicated" is very strong and did not happend. if it did, he wouldn't be praying liturgies in East Brunswick.
[quote author=PopeKyrillos link=topic=6247.msg82442#msg82442 date=1203444476]
Another thing is that if the priest didn't pray the liturgy then he probably shouldn't be distributing the body or blood.
NO it's not wrong. a preist can come and help in communion. He just wont be able to do the other things like the other priests who served. because he wouldn't be fasting so he's can't drink from the cup and the most he would do is wash his hand after finishing.
[quote author=His Servant link=topic=6247.msg82452#msg82452 date=1203456409]
hold on i think were mixed up i think im talking about a sermon and your talking about announcments. that i understand. but during the sermon can't abouna close the curtain so that everyone sits down?
hard to control ppl while that, and if there is a sermon, you know ppl are mostly not listening....except if it was a nice qiuck liturgy.
[quote author=Meena_Ameen link=topic=6247.msg82451#msg82451 date=1203456138]
I dont want to disrespect the priest as Pope Kyrollos said, but even worse is i dont want Jesus to be disrespected like that.. I mean for the Lord to give us his own BODY and BLOOD and for us to treat it like its just not THAT great is the most disrespectfull thing... Even if there are a few crumbs left that havent been consumed, that should still be enough for everyone to be silent in its presence and the only talking should be the singing of hymns glorifying God.
ya habibi you are not disrespecting the Body and Blood at all. this things are part of church matters, nothing wrong with that.
I know what excommunicated means but I thought he literally was excommunicated. I didn't know that he just left Chicago to go to another church.
I know what excommunicated means but I thought he literally was excommunicated. I didn't know that he just left Chicago to go to another church.
Fr. Shenouda is a very well-known and respected person, the servant of HH Kerrolos VI. i personnally visited him ones and he have things for HH that no one else would have.
other than that, i know that he left the church, after he actually build it, because of problems with the ppl.
also i don't think ppl would get excommunicated because of speaking during communion. especially a holy monk-hegumen.
I have to say that i dissagree with you minagir on this and i do think it is disrespectfull. I mean, we dont even bow our heads before the body and blood, the LEAST we can do is wait till the mass is over before we start talking about church trips and what not. Think of it this way because this is exactly how it is... If you saw Jesus appear in the altar while communion was taking place would u turn around and start talking about other things, or what you face Jesus the entire time bowing ur heads and singing praises to him? NO 1 would even turn their head for a second if they could physically see Christ during the communion. Just because we cant see him is not an excuse to rush the mass and not wait another 5 minutes for his body and blood to be consumed.
I have to say that i dissagree with you minagir on this and i do think it is disrespectfull. I mean, we dont even bow our heads before the body and blood, the LEAST we can do is wait till the mass is over before we start talking about church trips and what not. Think of it this way because this is exactly how it is... If you saw Jesus appear in the altar while communion was taking place would u turn around and start talking about other things, or what you face Jesus the entire time bowing ur heads and singing praises to him? NO 1 would even turn their head for a second if they could physically see Christ during the communion. Just because we cant see him is not an excuse to rush the mass and not wait another 5 minutes for his body and blood to be consumed.
you bow to Jesus Christ UNTILL He is in you. that's why when you go take the body, you bow before entring the altar. after that, if u go to the altar again, you DO NOT bow. because there is no one to bow to. He is IN YOU.
Thats a good point MinaGir...but...thats like saying once you take communion JUST YOU you can leave the mass because hes already in you
i didn't say u can leave. i just considered ur concept of bowing down to Jesus.
no one can leave the liturgy except when the priest sends away the angle of the sacrifice. even those who didn't take communion.
Anyway, regarding your situation, maybe you can suggest to abouna to have these announcements before or after the sermon-that is what my priest does. And its when abouna says "Go in Peace" or the dismissal is when we ought to leave the church btw.
GB
Tony
Minagir, did an authoritative figure of the church tell you that? if so, i would like to know who.
Anyway, regarding your situation, maybe you can suggest to abouna to have these announcements before or after the sermon-that is what my priest does. And its when abouna says "Go in Peace" or the dismissal is when we ought to leave the church btw.
GB
Tony
whats "that"? the bowing part or leaving church. cuz the leaving church part you just cinfirmed. about the bowing part, my lead deacons told me that and when we spoke to abouna, he didn't deny it. i can confirm with him again.
GB
Tony
I was talking about the bowing. I also have heard this before but not from an authoritative source. Let me ask you another question....Do you kiss abouna's hand after communion?
GB
Tony
you always kiss abouna's hand. tghat will never change cuz his hands are the same all the time, blessed from touching the body and blood. this also applys to the relics of saints. why, because your just taking blessings, nothing else.
that barefoot saying doesn't sound right cuz while taking communion, you are barefooted soo...
/
mahraeel
plzzz p4m sister in Christ
The part about barefoot from my understanding is when you don't have socks on and just walking around uneven and unclean terrain because something can get into your leg then you would bleed causing your blood which mixed with the Body and Blood of Christ to be released then with whatever you clean that blood with have to be burned and .... so on. I think we all know why we go in barefoot (usually with socks on) to take Communion or do I need to explain that one? let me know if you need me to.
Now for the original question about 1) giving blood and 2) Announcements
1) The priest that comes in to give blood if you notice does not wear his Tonya he wears just a golden garment that is about chest level in the front and all the way down to his legs from the back and he helps with giving the blood then hands the CUP back to the priest praying the Liturgy. And Again priests do that to help speed up the process esp in egypt where it would take forever to give Communion to all these people
2) For the announcements part that really goes back to the priest, i saw priest yell and scream if somebody talks during Communion, some even get mad if the correct Alhan are not said and others do not mind the annoucements/sermon to save time for the next Liturgy (which praises God, and saves people's spiritual lifes)
If you have questions/comments let me know on here or pm me.
I disagree with the part where it is mentioned that after Communion you should not bow when entering the Altar because the Altar is the Holly of the Holliest no matter what and Christ is always present in the church even when the mass is not being conducted.
you are also the holy one of God, especially when He is in you. I am not against the part where He is in church, of course He is. It's His house. nice way to put it...never thought about it that way.