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Christianity Courses in University?
Hi,
I have a chance to take 2 elective courses in University and there are some courses on Christianity as options. I am wondering if this is a good idea and if they teach sound teachings in the these courses. Here some of the options:
Modern Study of the Bible:
An introduction to the discipline of modern biblical criticism focusing on the development of selected central themes.
The Five Books of Moses:
An examination of selected texts from the Pentateuch and their significance for Ancient Israelite religion and modern thought.
Prophets of the Bible:
The role and teaching of biblical prophets in their ancient setting and their impact on modern religious life and thought.
Earliest Portraits of Jesus:
A study of the Gospels of Matthew, Mark, and Luke. Special attention will be given to the possible literary relationships among them as well as to the distinctive features of their Jesus stories.
Paul and Christian Origins:
A study of the controversial role played by Paul in the definition and expansion of early Christianity, based on the Acts of the Apostles and Paul's own extant correspondence.
Christianity in the Patristic Period:
The development of Christianity in the first centuries C.E. in relation to competing alternatives such as Judaism, Graeco-Roman cults and philosophies.
I have a chance to take 2 elective courses in University and there are some courses on Christianity as options. I am wondering if this is a good idea and if they teach sound teachings in the these courses. Here some of the options:
Modern Study of the Bible:
An introduction to the discipline of modern biblical criticism focusing on the development of selected central themes.
The Five Books of Moses:
An examination of selected texts from the Pentateuch and their significance for Ancient Israelite religion and modern thought.
Prophets of the Bible:
The role and teaching of biblical prophets in their ancient setting and their impact on modern religious life and thought.
Earliest Portraits of Jesus:
A study of the Gospels of Matthew, Mark, and Luke. Special attention will be given to the possible literary relationships among them as well as to the distinctive features of their Jesus stories.
Paul and Christian Origins:
A study of the controversial role played by Paul in the definition and expansion of early Christianity, based on the Acts of the Apostles and Paul's own extant correspondence.
Christianity in the Patristic Period:
The development of Christianity in the first centuries C.E. in relation to competing alternatives such as Judaism, Graeco-Roman cults and philosophies.
Comments
I took an introductory course to the New Testament in university. Not everything is 'orthodox' per se, but it is certainly a great learning experience. I highly recommend it.
If I was in your shoes, I would take 'the 5 books of Moses' course or the 'Prophets of the Bible' course. Mainly because I know so little about the Hebrew Bible (O.T.) and this is a great opportunity to do some serious study in that area.
My advice to you if you want to narrow your choices is to: 1. Pray, and then 2. Choose your other classes first and see where you have time in your schedule.
Earliest Portraits of Jesus:
A study of the Gospels of Matthew, Mark, and Luke. Special attention will be given to the possible literary relationships among them as well as to the distinctive features of their Jesus stories.
or,
Christianity in the Patristic Period:
The development of Christianity in the first centuries C.E. in relation to competing alternatives such as Judaism, Graeco-Roman cults and philosophies.
You did not post curriculum details. Just in case, you'll have to stand firm in your faith and consider this may not be a religious course (like the spiritual Bible study) but analytical academic style studies discussing any religion.
GBU
Most schools will really not look at any "real" religious aspect.
Also, as with any historical courses, there will be tainting and bias relative to the professor.
I did not take history or "Christian" related in schools, knowing very well, that I would not achieve anything towards my mine understanding.
Please excuse my confusion for posting this response on the other related discussion.
Recent posts may provide you with some insight concerning your consideration whether to subject yourself to non-orthodox, secular bible study/ comparative religion courses.
The first five courses that you listed are defined as modern criticisms, which directly implies that they are criticisms of our traditional apostolic, patristic orthodoxy. You can also be pretty well assured that all of these courses offered by a secular university will most probably have demonic feminist objectives, which diametrically oppose a traditional orthodox patriarchal paradigm, in order to accomodate the general feminist demands of secular women (and men) faculty and students. If your orthodox formation is not exceptionally strong, these courses would be somewhat a danger to your orthodox faith formation. If your orthodox formation is very confident, these courses would not seem to be of any reasonable benefit.
The sixth course, Christianity in the Patristic Period, should directly address the early history of our apostolic orthodox churches. However, the course could primarily be a “modern” criticism of the origins of orthodox christianity. A review of the course texts may clarify its objectives. The setting of this course should be about 500-1000 years before major Roman Catholic perversions and about 1500 years before Protestant innovations. This course could be of some background value to your orthodox development. The course should especially be an opportunity to study some of the works of our early Orthodox Holy Fathers and of their opponents.
You may also want to give consideration to the content of recent posts that seem relevant to your concerns for your orthodox formation. In response to your post, Cephas has proudly noted that a similar course was a great learning experience for him. This seems curiously revealing to me because he has recently submitted, without providing any requested factual, peer-reviewed and scriptural support and authorities; puzzling, seemingly clairvoyant, self-condemning, summaries of his prophetic, moral, freudian and orthodox thealogical beliefs and practices, as follows:
[quote author=????? link=topic=11418.msg140644#msg140644 date=1309546412]
+ Irini nem ehmot,
Having read your posts here as well as on coptichymns, I can safely say that it comes as no surprise that you are divorced. You are a vile misogynist and what self respecting woman would ever want to be with a creature such as yourself. I feel sorry for your ex-wife for having had to deal with you. Everything you write is demonic, deceptive and dishonest. You know nothing about Orthodoxy or God, as St. John says, 'If a man say, I love God, and hates his brother, he is a liar: for he that loves not his brother whom he has seen, how can he love God whom he has not seen?' (1 John 4:20) and again 'But whoever hates his brother is in the darkness and walks around in the darkness; he does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded him.' (1 John 2:11).
God is not patriarchal and the notion is completely laughable. The Middle Eastern culture may be patriarchal but that does not extend to God. This is clear in the dealings of Christ with the women of His time. He tore down the concept of a patriarchal worldview repeatedly. The case of the woman with the issue of blood, the case of the Samaritan woman, the case of the Canaanite woman (need I go on?).
It is clear to me that you have a long way to go in truly understanding what Orthodoxy is, and, quite frankly, I'm disgusted that you have been welcomed into the Orthodox Church when you hold so much hatred for the opposite sex. Orthodoxy is a precious pearl that should not be cast before swine such as yourself.
and
[quote author=????? link=topic=11418.msg140650#msg140650 date=1309549698]
+ Irini nem ehmot,
Father bless!
[quote author=Father Peter link=topic=11418.msg140647#msg140647 date=1309548050]
Why is a patriarchal point of view the same as hatred of women? I don't believe it is at all.
I never said it was. I'm saying that if a person has an innate hatred of women, they can use a patriarchal point of view to spread the hatred.
and
[quote author=????? link=topic=11418.msg140662#msg140662 date=1309560410]
+ Irini nem ehmot,
They say that imitation is the highest form of flattery. In your case 'Retarded' you are just pathetic. You have no personality of your own and so copy an already existing profile. That is beyond lame, and just prove that you are nothing. You are nobody. I just hope the moderators/administrators will take appropriate action in either editing your profile or completely removing it for being a troll.
and
[quote author=????? link=topic=11418.msg140690#msg140690 date=1309614798]
+ Irini nem ehmot,
Unworthy1,
While I still have the content of the posts, the quote function would not have illustrated how he copied my entire profile (name, picture and signature). My comments still stand and I'll add that 'Retarded' is also a spineless coward.
Do these reckless statements represent the beliefs and practices you seek to develop?
Being a former Protestant and university and Bible college student, any Bible and/or Christianity course offered at a university is either based on and developed by Protestant scholarship, Roman Catholic scholarship, or a hybrid of both, and are thus extremely dangerous to your soul as an Orthodox Christian. If you would like to take an elective in that area, do a correspondence course from an Orthodox seminary, college, or university that will transfer to your current university. There are plenty of accredited Orthodox schools whose credit will transfer and will provide you with more sound education.
St. Arseny Institute at the Univeristy of Manitoba in Winnipeg, MB; St. Tikhon's Seminary in South Canaan, PA; and Holy Trinity Seminary in Jordanville, NY, are three really good options--all EO, but that is what I am most familiar with because I am EO. There are also really good OO schools out there, and if you can find those, then that's awesome too.
Be sure to safeguard your soul, lest at any time you become the prey of the noetic wolf who is out to deceive you, especially in the Protestant and Roman Catholic schools.
[quote author=joseph.vandenbrink link=topic=11783.msg141391#msg141391 date=1310526814]
Being a former Protestant and university and Bible college student, any Bible and/or Christianity course offered at a university is either based on and developed by Protestant scholarship, Roman Catholic scholarship, or a hybrid of both, and are thus extremely dangerous to your soul as an Orthodox Christian.
Be sure to safeguard your soul, lest at any time you become the prey of the noetic wolf who is out to deceive you, especially in the Protestant and Roman Catholic schools.
Forgive me, but don't you think this is a little bit extreme? I think any person choosing to take an elective on modern Biblical criticism at any university is at least remotely aware that what is taught will probably not be 100% orthodox. Of course, as you pointed out, the ideal is to take courses from an accredited Orthodox seminary. However, not everyone may be able to do that (for whatever reason). Going in with the knowledge that what is taught may or may not be strictly Orthodox teachings is sufficient defense (in my opinion) against any sort of heterodox teachings. In the process, it opens a person up to know perspectives, which is something the Fathers themselves experienced, particularly at the School of Alexandria. They learned about everything, and then applied an Orthodox mindset to it.
If such courses lead to questions about doctrine and dogma, all the better. It will allow a person to grow further in the faith. Blind faith, a faith without any understanding, is a most dangerous thing indeed.
Ask any priest or bishop about what I said.
Unfortunately, there aren't many OO seminaries in the U.S.
As far as there not being any OO seminaries in North America, there is one (in Ottawa, if I remember correctly), but it isn't accredited. At the moment, many OO clergy and candidates for ordination are attending St. Tikhon's Seminary in South Canaan, PA. Because the EO and OO are identical in all things theological and moral, it is acceptable for OO seminarians to attend EO seminaries.
I am a convert from Protestantism, which is just the other side of the coin of Roman Catholicism. Believe me when I say that those of you who grew up in the Church are so blessed to have the richness and safety of the Saints, hymns, canons of the councils, writings of the holy Fathers, and the services of the Church to safeguard the Truth. But even in this, there is pollution creeping because EO and OO equally allowed and even encouraged the faithful to purcahse and study Protestant and Roman Catholic translations of the Bible, Protestant and Roman commentaries, Protestant and Roman devotionals, etc. These things are so incredibly poisonous and lets small amounts of poison in at a time--so small that it is undetectable--and that over time the Orthodox Christian loses the mind of the Church and develops the mind of sectarianism and individualism, and eventually they are not longer Orthodox. If you cannot believe this, look at the vast number of faithful leaving the Orthodox faith for Protestant and Roman gatherings. They have traded the Truth for a lie because their faith was watered down by the blasphemies and heresies of Rome and her illegitimate daughters of the Protestant revolution (or, "reformation") by means of instructional materials that were laced with their intoxicating and noxious poisons.
In order to keep myself safe, I have had to discard all my Protestant materials, trading them for prayer books, writings of the holy Fathers, lives of the Saints, and above all an Orthodox translation of the Holy Scriptures. It is not out of hate that say this and do this, but out of desperate concern for the salvation of my soul and the souls of all.
Please do not misunderstand me, though I understand if you do. I am truly terrified to see yet another Orthodox Christian fall to the noetic wolf.
Please pray for me in my pride
I must say, I greatly admire and respect your zeal for Orthodoxy. I find that converts to Orthodoxy truly appreciate the faith more so than cradle Orthodox (I speak of myself in paritcular) who often take it for granted. You do raise a number of valid points and I appreciate your perspective as one who was heterodox and has returned home. Thank you for your insight.
I have just personally found that such courses have helped me appreciate Orthodoxy more. It has been a springboard for me to read more about what the Fathers have taught regarding the faith. In addition, it has allowed me to keep an open mind about other views in regards to Biblical criticism and interpretations. My experience has been nothing but positive, which is why, I suppose, I'm not as negative in my perspective about such courses.
I have just personally found that such courses have helped me appreciate Orthodoxy more. It has been a springboard for me to read more about what the Fathers have taught regarding the faith. In addition, it has allowed me to keep an open mind about other views in regards to Biblical criticism and interpretations. My experience has been nothing but positive, which is why, I suppose, I'm not as negative in my perspective about such courses.
Glory to God for all things!
As to the topic of the thread, I would say that there's nothing you can learn in school about religion that you can't learn much better outside of school by practicing your religion under the direction of a spiritual father...but then, I am a recovering Roman Catholic, so my view is somewhat warped by my distaste for overly bookish philosophizing masquerading as religious enlightenment... ::)
[quote author=joseph.vandenbrink link=topic=11783.msg141399#msg141399 date=1310531005]
I must apologise, by the way. I can see how I seem really harsh. I ask you, dear Brothers and Sisters, to afford me to say this:
I am a convert from Protestantism, which is just the other side of the coin of Roman Catholicism. Believe me when I say that those of you who grew up in the Church are so blessed to have the richness and safety of the Saints, hymns, canons of the councils, writings of the holy Fathers, and the services of the Church to safeguard the Truth. But even in this, there is pollution creeping because EO and OO equally allowed and even encouraged the faithful to purcahse and study Protestant and Roman Catholic translations of the Bible, Protestant and Roman commentaries, Protestant and Roman devotionals, etc. These things are so incredibly poisonous and lets small amounts of poison in at a time--so small that it is undetectable--and that over time the Orthodox Christian loses the mind of the Church and develops the mind of sectarianism and individualism, and eventually they are not longer Orthodox. If you cannot believe this, look at the vast number of faithful leaving the Orthodox faith for Protestant and Roman gatherings. They have traded the Truth for a lie because their faith was watered down by the blasphemies and heresies of Rome and her illegitimate daughters of the Protestant revolution (or, "reformation") by means of instructional materials that were laced with their intoxicating and noxious poisons.
In order to keep myself safe, I have had to discard all my Protestant materials, trading them for prayer books, writings of the holy Fathers, lives of the Saints, and above all an Orthodox translation of the Holy Scriptures. It is not out of hate that say this and do this, but out of desperate concern for the salvation of my soul and the souls of all.
Please do not misunderstand me, though I understand if you do. I am truly terrified to see yet another Orthodox Christian fall to the noetic wolf.
Please pray for me in my pride
As far as a NT translation, I would go here: http://www.holyapostlesconvent.org/hac-products.shtml. My priest has the NT published here and it is an amazing translation to use even for liturgical readings. He says it's a little clumsy if you are just sitting and reading it, but he also says that Orthodox Christians should not be just sitting and reading it like a book, but rather reading it out loud. Historically, even in their homes with their families, Orthodox Christians traditionally would intone (sing) the Scripture readings. This translation is most ideal for that.
If nothing else, the King James Version is not translated from the Masoretic text, but from the Septuagint, but it provides the Masoretic text variances in footnotes (in some editions), which is the only downfall. It also uses proper English, which may take a little getting used to if you aren't a native English speaker.
I hope this helps.