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Archbishops in the Coptic Church

PopeKyrillosPopeKyrillos
edited December 1969 in Coptic Orthodox Church
Hey Everyone,

I have been wondering recently why the Coptic Church does not have Archbishops? Originally, I thought the rank was just randomly created by the Catholic church then realized that most other Orthodox (EO and OO) have them. I know people say the Pope is the Archbishop but thats not really explaining it. Other people say that we have metropolitan bishops, however, that rank isn't really above a bishop. It's more just respect for a senior bishop or a bishop of a large city such as the Giza.

PK

Comments

  • minatasgeelminatasgeel
    we do have an archbishop........Anba Avram of Jerusalem.
  • ilovesaintmarkilovesaintmark
    There are distinctions to the titular and ecclesiastical use of the word Archbishop in the different Apostolic churches.

    Examples:

    1. Syrian Orthodox Church (Jacobite--OO) grants that title to all of Its bishops.
    2.  The Armenian Church tends to do that for diocesan seated bishops, and will give the title "bishop" to non-seated and administrative type scenarios (similar to the Coptic Orthodox use of the concept and title "General Bishop").  Very rarely they will use it for a newly consecrated Bishop of a Diocese prior to a ceremony towards his elevation to Archbishop.  This was the case of the current Archbishop of the Eastern Diocese, HE, Archbishop Khajag Barsamian.
    3.  In the Greek Orthodox Archdiocese of North and South America, the Archbishop is granted semi-independent ability to ordain bishops for the different jurisdictions of the Archdiocese.
    4.  The Orthodox Church in America is administered by a Metropolitan with the similar authority as the above stated Greek Orthodox Archbishop.
    5.  The Coptic Orthodox Metropolitan of Jerusalem is known specifically by the name Anba Abraham (not Avraam).  Aram is the name of the Catholicos of the Armenians (Antelias/Cilicia Jurisdiction).  The office of the Coptic Orthodox Metropolitan is evolving relative to His Holiness Pope Shenouda III.  Relative to the political and protocol issues that are unique to the Jurisdiction of the Holy City, HH has looked towards the elevation of the jurisdiction with the title of Archbishop or even "Patriarch".  As it stands, he is solely with the title "Metropolitan".  The Holy Synod website identifies him as such.  I am not aware of any papal or synodal edicts changing that title.  HE, Anba Abraham has been given extensive latitude towards executing the duties and ministries in the Holy City.

    6.  The Alexandrine use of the title for His Holiness, is to specifically identify him as the Bishop with protocol above all bishops in the Holy Synod of the Coptic Orthodox Church.  It, again, is a different usage and implementation.  This is in keeping with the precedence in use from the Apostolic Times, and Post-Nicene era.

    7.  In the Roman Catholic Church, it is to identify size and prestige of a given diocese or archdiocese.  They do not have independent ability to consecrate bishops.  All consecrations must be carried out in Rome.  There have been exceptions with regard to some places, such as, China.  There is considerable secrecy with regard to administration and ordinations relative the repressive aspect of the Chinese Government.

    If all of this does not make sense, you are correct.  It is a mish mosh.  It is actually even more complicated than all of my writing.  You need a baseball scorecard to keep track of everything.
  • ilovesaintmarkilovesaintmark
    In the regard of the Protestant Sects--beyond description.  No comment.
  • imikhailimikhail
    [quote author=minatasgeel link=topic=12223.msg143875#msg143875 date=1314669361]
    we do have an archbishop........Anba Avram of Jerusalem.


    Anba Abraam is a metropolitan not an archbishop. His name should be mentioned the first because of the honor of his throne. Our archbishop is Pope Shenouda.
  • minatasgeelminatasgeel
    [quote author=imikhail link=topic=12223.msg143898#msg143898 date=1314731782]
    [quote author=minatasgeel link=topic=12223.msg143875#msg143875 date=1314669361]
    we do have an archbishop........Anba Avram of Jerusalem.


    Anba Abraam is a metropolitan not an archbishop. His name should be mentioned the first because of the honor of his throne. Our archbishop is Pope Shenouda.

    He is: The Archbishop of the Archdiocese of Jerusalem. You cannot have a bishop on an archdiocese.
  • imikhailimikhail
    [quote author=minatasgeel link=topic=12223.msg143905#msg143905 date=1314749079]
    [quote author=imikhail link=pic=12223.msg143898#msg143898 date=1314731782]
    [quote author=minatasgeel link=topic=12223.msg143875#msg143875 date=1314669361]
    we do have an archbishop........Anba Avram of Jerusalem.


    Anba Abraam is a metropolitan not an archbishop. His name should be mentioned the first because of the honor of his throne. Our archbishop is Pope Shenouda.

    He is: The Archbishop of the Archdiocese of Jerusalem. You cannot have a bishop on an archdiocese.


    He is not an archbishop. The only archbishop is pope Shenouda. The archdiocese is Alexandria not Jerusalem.
  • ilovesaintmarkilovesaintmark
    The Holy City is not an Archdiocese.

    There are (were) situations where a Bishop will (was) be in charge of a Metropolitanate.

    HE, Metropolitan Abraham of Jerusalem, is not an Archbishop.

    As I mentioned, previously, HH has over the course of the last twenty years reviewed the position of the Metropolitan of the Holy City of Jerusalem as it apertains to the Coptic Orthodox Patriarchate.  His Holiness has answered questions and has reviewed the situation and possibly changing his (the metropolitan's title) and possibly elevating that particular jurisdiction in keeping with the other Churches presence in the area, ie, Latin, Armenian, Byzantine, etc).

    Another example, in the Armenian Church, where there is a hierarchical titular difference from the Coptic perspective.  The Armenian Archbishop of Jerusalem is granted the title "Patriarch" which is subordinate to the title "Catholicos", which the Armenians identify as the Supreme Pontiff of the Armenian Church (whether Etchmiadzin or Cilicia).  However, in the Coptic Church, the title "Catholicos" is subordinate to the title "Patriarch"; except in the situation of dealing with the protocol to the Armenian Church.

    Most definitely, Jerusalem is not an Archdiocese.
    Most definitely, HE Abba Abraham is not an Archbishop.

    Another example, Bp David is not a metropolitan nor archbishop, but, yet, as a bishop, he administers the Archdiocese on behalf of Pope Shenouda.
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