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What are the rites for the sunday before the first day (monday) of Great Lent?

hany58hany58
edited December 1969 in Hymns Discussion
Hi Everyone,

Can you please tell me what are the rites for the sunday before the first day (monday) of Great Lent? Do we say anything from the Great Lent rites at all? please tell what your sources are. thanks
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Comments

  • minatasgeelminatasgeel
    [quote author=baladoos link=topic=12914.msg152002#msg152002 date=1329348395]
    Hi Everyone,

    Can you please tell me what are the rites for the sunday before the first day (monday) of Great Lent? Do we say anything from the Great Lent rites at all? please tell what your sources are. thanks

    I was told that it is exactly like the last friday of lent. Now i can't confirm that from a book but i believe it is much true.
  • egyboyegyboy
    I'm pretty sure its annual.
  • minatasgeelminatasgeel
    wait, i am sorry. i thought you are asking about THE MONDAY and not sunday. That Sunday liturgy has it's on reading, it the the Preparation Sunday. It also has a unique rite. it is annual until the Gospel. than from the gospel response and on is lent. the response that is to be said is Je peniot, in weekend lenten tune. then you can say everything for lent after that even psalm 150 and conclusion/
  • Amoussa01
    Mina,

    can you provide a source?
  • imikhailimikhail
    [quote author=Amoussa01 link=topic=12914.msg152016#msg152016 date=1329373060]
    Mina,

    can you provide a source?


    Minatasgeel is correct ...

    The source is tarteeb albay3a
  • minatasgeelminatasgeel
    [quote author=Amoussa01 link=topic=12914.msg152016#msg152016 date=1329373060]
    Mina,

    can you provide a source?

    Anba Mettaous rite book.....and imikhail's word :-)
  • imikhailimikhail
    [quote author=minatasgeel link=topic=12914.msg152025#msg152025 date=1329399204]
    [quote author=Amoussa01 link=topic=12914.msg152016#msg152016 date=1329373060]
    Mina,

    can you provide a source?

    Anba Mettaous rite book.....and imikhail's word :-)


    :-[
  • Amoussa01
    Mina,

    You said "you can say" psalm 150 and the conclusion. Are you implying that it is optional to choose between the Lent or Annual rite? Is that what the book specifically states?
  • Cyril97Cyril97

    In the Rite of the Great Lent, the Liturgy of the Catechumens on the Sunday preceding the Holy Lent is prayed as usual. The readings however are taken from the Lectionary of the Great Lent and not from the annual readings. The Divine Liturgy is also prayed in the Annual Rite with the exception that the Fraction is read that of the Great Lent. Also, Psalm 150 is chanted during communion in the tune of the Lenten Saturdays and Sundays, followed by the Praise of the First Week of the Holy Lent, and the concluding creed for the end of service for the Saturdays and Sundays of the Holy Lent. This is all done to remind the believers that the Lent is to start the following day.

    ~copticheritage.org (HCOC Website)
    http://www.copticheritage.org/rites/10_the_great_lent
    Hope this answers your question,
    Cyril
  • minatasgeelminatasgeel
    [quote author=Amoussa01 link=topic=12914.msg152038#msg152038 date=1329415949]
    Mina,

    You said "you can say" psalm 150 and the conclusion. Are you implying that it is optional to choose between the Lent or Annual rite? Is that what the book specifically states?

    oh. No. this is a must. the lent rite begins from Je peniout of that sunday liturgy. there is no going back.
  • Cyril97Cyril97
    ...do not turn back...you CAN'T trun back...lest you be turned into a pillar of salt... ;)  ;D
  • Amoussa01
    thanks Mina and Cyril...I was just on that site...I don't know how i missed that
  • andrew8345andrew8345
    [quote author=Cyril97 link=topic=12914.msg152041#msg152041 date=1329424373]

    In the Rite of the Great Lent, the Liturgy of the Catechumens on the Sunday preceding the Holy Lent is prayed as usual. The readings however are taken from the Lectionary of the Great Lent and not from the annual readings. The Divine Liturgy is also prayed in the Annual Rite with the exception that the Fraction is read that of the Great Lent. Also, Psalm 150 is chanted during communion in the tune of the Lenten Saturdays and Sundays, followed by the Praise of the First Week of the Holy Lent, and the concluding creed for the end of service for the Saturdays and Sundays of the Holy Lent. This is all done to remind the believers that the Lent is to start the following day.

    ~copticheritage.org (HCOC Website)
    http://www.copticheritage.org/rites/10_the_great_lent
    Hope this answers your question,
    Cyril


    This doesn't say anything about Je Peniot. . .

    So I'm a bit confused, do we treat it as if it were a regular weekend of the Great Lent (Je Peniot, Meghalo, etc.)?
  • minatasgeelminatasgeel
    [quote author=Andrew link=topic=12914.msg152048#msg152048 date=1329428917]
    So I'm a bit confused, do we treat it as if it were a regular weekend of the Great Lent (Je Peniot, Meghalo, etc.)?

    Sunday morning from Matins till the sermon (if your church has them) is annual. Then the Lent gospel response is said and the rest of the liturgy is prayed in the lent rite.
  • Cyril97Cyril97
    As for Meghalo, I am pretty sure that it is supposed to be sung before the gospel...
    So this is basically it...i don't know why it seems like you are complicating it... ;)
    Before Gospel= ANNUAL
    During Gospel= PAY ATTENTION...Lol...
    After the Gospel = U switch so now as soon as you say "Glory be to God forever"...u have just entered LENT MODE...lol
    Everything thereafter is Lent, until Palm Sunday...and I think you got it from there...lol ;) :P
  • minatasgeelminatasgeel
    [quote author=Cyril97 link=topic=12914.msg152058#msg152058 date=1329430823]
    ....Everything thereafter is Lent, until Palm Sunday...and I think you got it from there...lol ;) :P

    until the last friday of lent rather than Palm sunday.
  • andrew8345andrew8345
    Got it.

    It is just that the HCOC explanation just mentions that the Fraction and Psalm 150 are the exceptions and that everything else is said 'annually'. . .

    I.e. there is no mention of chanting Je Peniot. . .
  • mark.naguib7
    [quote author=Cyril97 link=topic=12914.msg152058#msg152058 date=1329430823]
    As for Meghalo, I am pretty sure that it is supposed to be sung before the gospel...
    So this is basically it...i don't know why it seems like you are complicating it... ;)
    Before Gospel= ANNUAL
    During Gospel= PAY ATTENTION...Lol...
    After the Gospel = U switch so now as soon as you say "Glory be to God forever"...u have just entered LENT MODE...lol
    Everything thereafter is Lent, until Palm Sunday...and I think you got it from there...lol ;) :P


    So no Meghalo?
  • minatasgeelminatasgeel
    [quote author=Copticandproud link=topic=12914.msg152073#msg152073 date=1329446818]
    So no Meghalo?

    asorry....no
  • mark.naguib7
    AHHH!! It took me forever to memorize it and now I can not say it :( Oh well next week God Willing...
  • Cyril97Cyril97
    Or you couls ing it on monday...if your charch has a mass then, and if you could go...
    I don't know where you live, but here in Ontario, Canada, the first monday of the lent is
    a provincial holiday...(family day)...lol...So God willing, I'll be attending a mass that day...lol...
    and hopefully, we will sing MEGHALOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!
    LOL...God bless, and please pray for me,
    Cyril
  • andrew8345andrew8345
    [quote author=Copticandproud link=topic=12914.msg152076#msg152076 date=1329449255]
    AHHH!! It took me forever to memorize it and now I can not say it :( Oh well next week God Willing...


    You still get to partake of the Body and Blood.
  • mark.naguib7
    [quote author=Andrew link=topic=12914.msg152154#msg152154 date=1329516840]
    [quote author=Copticandproud link=topic=12914.msg152076#msg152076 date=1329449255]
    AHHH!! It took me forever to memorize it and now I can not say it :( Oh well next week God Willing...


    You still get to partake of the Body and Blood.


    :) :-X
  • mark.naguib7
    Were we supposed to say the Lent Psali watos in vespers today?
  • minatasgeelminatasgeel
    [quote author=Copticandproud link=topic=12914.msg152207#msg152207 date=1329623480]
    Were we supposed to say the Lent Psali watos in vespers today?

    no/
  • Cyril97Cyril97
    BTW, for those who get a chance to read this, I was told that in Albair's book, the only LENT stuff said on
    Sunday would be the fraction and the psalm 150, and like everything after...but NO Je Peniot...
    Either way, its probably too late... ;) Oh well...! Lol :P
    God bless, and please pray for me,
    Cyril
  • minatasgeelminatasgeel
    [quote author=Cyril97 link=topic=12914.msg152211#msg152211 date=1329652271]
    BTW, for those who get a chance to read this, I was told that in Albair's book, the only LENT stuff said on
    Sunday would be the fraction and the psalm 150, and like everything after...but NO Je Peniot...
    Either way, its probably too late... ;) Oh well...! Lol :P
    God bless, and please pray for me,
    Cyril

    http://www.st-mary-alsourian.com/Library/Books/scanjhhnjjhn010.pdf
    page 49 left side. now he doesn't include the aspasmos.....so maybe i was wrong about that. but je peniout is said and the psalm...etc.
  • mark.naguib7
    What about the Doxology and the Verses of cymbals? Because our priest made us say them and I was like abouna al-refa3 bokra and he was like no 7abiby it is today and tomorrow.(Saturday night and Sunday)
  • minatasgeelminatasgeel
    [quote author=Copticandproud link=topic=12914.msg152216#msg152216 date=1329659214]
    What about the Doxology and the Verses of cymbals? Because our priest made us say them and I was like abouna al-refa3 bokra and he was like no 7abiby it is today and tomorrow.(Saturday night and Sunday)

    Nope. the think is that the first week of lent is really a preparation. Sat and Sun of el-refa3 are not part of that week. so you can't really have a preparation for the preparation. having je peniout and some 150 in lent tune reminds the people that lent begins--gives them a small taste of what's to come in the next couple of weeks.
  • mabsootamabsoota
    we are orthodox and say a prayer before praying.
    so why not a preparation for the preparation?!
    ;)

    joking, it's al refa'a next sunday (i argued about that last week and was wrong), but we are sort of preparing for lent by clearing out our cupboards and our hearts.
    :)
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