I think we all agree that we do not know how God will judge the world and how He will judge particular people
there was a sermon by Fr Bishoy Andrawes (I am talking about Father Anthony's blessed partner), sorry to disrespect your service Father but you said a fisher of men gives different bait to all people. Many things people say like that confuse me what they mean but how I interpret it I agree
Now since we do not know what God will do to each soul but we all believe Jesus is LORD
I believe we should use the bible as our reference
The bible can make people believe in three possibilities which different people believe in one to the exclusion of others.
They are God will save the whole world, God will damn a soul for all ages which deserves it, and God will perish the wicked after punishing them
The concept that God will damn a soul for all ages is not a foolish idea with no grounds but we are not to desire this if it is not just.
It is based on the fact that those jewish pharisees saw Jesus crucified on a cross and still did not pity Him. When Jesus said Father Forgive them for they know not what they do
His salvation is offered to all of them yet Jesus called them children of the devil and the wicked one. They stayed not repenting even till their last breath when they were on earth because they wanted to steal the Fathers inheritance even though they knew he was the Christ because God reminded them through the psalms and all His works when He said "My God, My God why have You forsaken Me"
Salvation will still be offered to many souls after death is a possibility because Jesus says "And I if I am lifted up from the earth I will draw all peoples to Myself"
So even if they could repent after they die they would be accepted but God knew their impenintent heart that they really are children of the wicked one and will never repent
So when Jesus says "They will not get out of there until they have payed the last penny" it is true. But some will never pay that last penny it seems for God knew them
Also it is said "What shall it profit the man if he gains the whole world and is himself destroyed OR LOST
He was referring to devils
Why He said "Forgive them for they know not what they do" Is because He knew some of them do not know what they do and will be converted in this life or the next as He says
"Tax collectors and harlots enter the kingdom of God before you"
It is not enough for them to be received after that they are punished for their sins they must repent on their own.
"Unless you repent you will all likewise perish"
One reason I want to make this post is the complete mess people have made about christianity that God sends people to hell who do not deserve it, and they say they know so and so is in hell because they saw a vision
I do not feel comfortable holding this doctrine of our Heavenly Father and I would have crucified christ myself if He said that.
Christ desires all men to come to Him and to search the deep things of God is required from all people. Unfortunately it may be required for us to preach the gospel to be saved for the law and the prophets command to love the stranger and accept him. We perhaps should preach it not out of fear of going to hell but because it will make God happy to reconcile them to Himself. He wants to be merciful and only a fool things His judgements are tolerable
Now I do not believe that any church is perfect, though I believed mine was but my church people are not all open to going into the depths of the bible. Though they may be right they do not really preach the gospel and are not a civilised people sorry, because they do not even want to preach the gospel. You do not need to preach the gospel if you really do not think it is good news but you must really hope that all the innocent souls are saved.
Now I will turn my attention to the catholics. The catholics are completely wrong about Papal infallibility on matters of doctrine and that all must be under him. They are also wrong about indulgences and all the miracles are false. The visions made by their saints are hoaxes such as fatima and lourdes. They are also wrong about Peter being the head and through him there is no salvation when they quote "On this rock I will build my church" The orthodox are also wrong about St Mary apparition in Zeiuton possibly
some of them even pray to the saints unlike us and other stuff. They also do not preach the gospel enough and correctly and it is required for them if they want to preach the gospel to live a holy life. How can they say the pope is infallible when 96 percent of catholics use contraception and this is a matter of doctrine! I am not connecting this with living a holy life but it by chance seems connected. I should have said this in a more respectful manner and there is a slight chance that those miracles are true. When all the christians are doing God's will God will give us a true miracle PERHAPS
The basis of preaching the gospel is that "Noone is good but One, that is God"
and He does what He sees is best
A fisher of men will give hope to all. God has left it until now that He has not declared what He will do because He is giving everyone the chance for salvation but the bible even gives the hope of SALVATION FOR ALL
God may see it good that those who would never choose righteousness and chastity on their own instead of sin for them to perish or be lost
God has not told us
I do not know if I or God loves sinners enough who continue so without seeking reconciliation with God and doing good in this life, maybe there is the chance they will perish
Comments
And evolution is accepted
The best way to preach is by your actions. Words are cheap actions are priceless.
Agree. If your going to use words, then they would have to relate to the preson being preached too in an empathic way as in hope of taking the direction of Christ. Those who are humblily in need are probably best to preach too. The proud ones in need don't listen so well but I'd help them just the same.
And does Father Peter agree?
How come our church keeps saying different things
Just more support for what God thought about His enemies at that time
Why does God need us to help the poor can He not help the poor Himself by sending someone ? But then He must treat people fairly it is up to us to pity people more and make friends by unrighteousness mammon to the kingdom (money which is Gods)
So it seems God needs us to preach the gospel just like He needs us to help the poor I dont know why
The only deed which will count is that which has sacrifice and love
But we are responsible for not wasting the talents(money) which God has given us but must give only to the worthy
My dad thinks I am destroying my future with these thoughts
Please pray for me
These thoughts really do harm me to the point I don't know why I should do anything worldly related I want God to preach and God to help the poor
ReturnOrthodoxy
as we see dimly now when we see God face to face we shall see things how God sees them, God's decision will be respected and it will be seen as the only good that a good God could do. He commanded us not to judge anyone even the dead I suppose
God knows His commandments are not hard but people are stubborn and evil in not wanting to follow them, only if you want to reach perfection and saintliness will it be hard like when he said to go the extra mile and stuggling completely against every lust and sin and struggling hard in fasting or other spiritual and godly worldly things.
I am actually starting to feel afraid that maybe following all the commandments strictly is the only way to heaven with not much room for sin. Once we started our relationship with God when God saw it good to meet us from then it is expected blamelessness' and St Peter says he who does not follow all the commandments is blindsighted and has forgotted he has been cleansed from his sins
But that doesn't mean if you sin sometimes you should not preach the gospel, I should give other people a chance to go to heaven so as to lessen my own condemnation
In the example of the Son;
and in the fulfillment of the Inspiration of the Holy Spirit.
It's actually quite simple.
I find your post baffling. No one should preach when such a fear of God and his judgements is their missionary drive.
If you were a salesman, you need to convince the buyer that the product is good. If you're scarred of the product, or uncertain of what it will do, you'll be a terrible salesman. They cannot convince others, because they themselves are not convinced. To preach as a duty out of fear, is not an experience that can be found in the life of any Apostle or Evangelist. It is also not part of the example Christ set.
A good salesman is someone who knows his product and is confident in it. An even better salesman is someone who knows the product from their own experience and can explain why it is a good product.
Christ is so much sweeter than the sweetness of the world, that is why people become Christian. If a person knows this sweetness, then they have something which they can genuinely share with others. If we're asking questions about whether God will be kind enough to spare souls then we're far away from having an intimate relationship with Him. We're asking questions we would ask of an overlord and not a kind and merciful redeemer.
Christian example is important because Christians preach God's love and the restoration of creation. God demonstrates this practically through those who preach. A Christian missionary's job is to show that people who know God have real love and joy in their lives. They will struggle too, St Paul is the greatest example of this. He is never given over to grief by his struggle and is always confident in God no matter how bad things get. At the same time as being in prison or being shipwrecked, St Paul was a pillar of joy and strength. This is what persuaded people moreso than his message.
I'm also a bit concerned about the way that you're reading the scriptures, if a person reads in the right way, it doesn't raise these questions. In scripture we meet Christ and He is a friendly Soul. It isn't always pleasant for us, but this isn't Christ per se. It is what naturally happens when darkness approaches light, and the the darkness understands that it is darkness. We're this darkness, and we only realise it when we see Christ and recognise Him as light. A sin seems smaller when it is hidden, in the light of day, its true nature is known.
What does the darkness know about the nature of the light? Is it right for darkness to question the kindness or love of the light? Especially when it is the darkness that is evil, and the light that is good? If we are darkness, it is our own inner darkness that makes us doubt the goodness of God; God is not to be doubted, He is light.
Everyone has an experience with God; even miserable Pharaoh of Egypt. For most people, they just don't know what He's trying to tell them and how He is doing it. The job of a Christian missionary is to reveal to the other person that God is already here and He is trying to make a relationship with you.
Please pray for me,
LiD
Thankyou for your reply and thoughts so we should preach Gods love to those who look like they want some help and compassion?
We should preach it to people whatever their circumstances. We're not preaching a 'life improvement' as such. We're preaching the possibility of a relationship between a creature and its creator. It a bit like people who are raised with foster parents being given the opportunity to meet their real parents. Its a big issue in the life of that person, regardless of whether they're doing well or not. Everybody also responds to the question in different ways. Some will want to know, some will be angry, some will need time to think it over.
It is true that all of us have a lot of hurt in our lives and it can be a good starting point to preaching the Gospel. However, it must be no more than a starting point.
The Good News or Gospel is that this dividing wall between us and God has finally been broken down by Christ. We enter into this mystery by following the preaching, repenting and being Baptised in the name of the Holy Trinity.
The reason sin comes into it is because we're trying to explain how humanity became estranged from God originally. The Gospel message is a powerful positive one of reunion and healing.
Please pray for me,
LiD
I am quite sure that the whole of the old testament doesn't mention Gehenna, only sheol. There is also no scriptural linking of people outside of God's presence and Gehenna. The idea that these people are all going to Gehenna is an assumption which we make because there is nothing written but that doesn't make it correct.
The issue you've based these posts on is non-scriptural and the missionary imperative has been put the wrong way around. People who reject the Gospel go to Gehenna. The Gospel is not God reacting because everyone is going to Gehenna.
Please pray for me,
LiD
If they are not going to Gehenna where are they going
What do you mean by the gospel is not God reacting because everyone is going to Gehenna do you mean God does not care?
I know perish may mean to perish from the presence of God and being with God
What do u mean by Gehenna isnt that where the rubbish is burnt
If they are not going to Gehenna where are they going
Gehenna is eternal abode of the damned, or hell if you like, this is the name Christ used when speaking about it. The answer is we don't know, God hasn't told us. Only God knows what He plans to do with them. My dear, be wise with what you say. I said God isn't reacting to this because, we don't know that this is what will happen. We know that God cares because, once He finished His ministry on earth, He preached to the souls in Sheol.
So I can make other people lost it seems
If I have to be wise with what I say I am leaving this forum because as much as I try to be wise I am still a fool
So I can make other people lost it seems
I didn't want you writing anything you would come to regret. I believe you belong here.
But is there something about it that I should regret?
Btw are you the user life in death?
Thankyou for caring for my well being unfortunately I can not study and post at the same time but it is good to know when I want to discuss something I am welcome
It's weird that I have to leave you all I can only see those in my church
But God is with you all
I give no person permission to watch how I live my life and copy me because I am not always wise
These are all questions you should be addressing to him as he knows you and cares for you as his spiritual child.