[quote author=Andrew link=topic=13649.msg159265#msg159265 date=1345769820] [quote author=imikhail link=topic=13649.msg159245#msg159245 date=1345746040] The time of communion should be dedicated to remembering our salvation through the sacrifice of which we are partaking.
During this time we should be medititating only on Christ and what He had done for our salvation.
Let me ask this question: would it be ok to do glorification to a saint during the holy 50 days during communion? If not, why not?
I'm confused, imikhail.
You said that melodies revolving around the gospel of the day should be prayed during the distribution, and you also said that the hymns prayed during the distribution should focus solely on Christ and salvation through the sacrifice we are partaking...
Also, can you provide an example of the hymns you believe more appropriate?
Thank you.
Dear Andrew,
The question I posted is a rhetorical question. I do not think anyone who understands a bit about rituals would agree to have glorification during communion.
Same thing during the special seasons like Great Lent, Palm Sunday, ...
Annual season is no different Glorification became common during this season because the psaltos usually run out of prayers to say or because they feel they need to pray something different.
However, it is not up to us to choose what to say or what not to say depending on our mood. We need to follow the church rites rather than our own whims.
[quote author=minatasgeel link=topic=13649.msg159267#msg159267 date=1345776072] imikhail, are there specific madayeh for every sunday like you said before or NO????
Yes there are. Please check Al Kethare Alro7eya fee Madayeh All Kaneesa Alkebteya
[quote author=imikhail link=topic=13649.msg159272#msg159272 date=1345782924] [quote author=minatasgeel link=topic=13649.msg159267#msg159267 date=1345776072] imikhail, are there specific madayeh for every sunday like you said before or NO????
Yes there are. Please check Al Kethare Alro7eya fee Madayeh All Kaneesa Alkebteya
[quote author=ReturnOrthodoxy link=topic=13649.msg159274#msg159274 date=1345783953] The Body of Christ is the Church - both militant and victorious. So when we praise a saint, we are praising the body of XC.
ReturnOrthodoxy
With all due respect RO, should we just do anything regardless of the proper rite just because it makes sense?
You are correct. To be honest, I did not read through the whole thing. I just wanted to point out that it made sense. I will go back, and read through the whole thing, and I'll try to figure it out. I was actually in the class with Albeir in which he said that communion is the proper time for glorification according to the old rite.
[quote author=minatasgeel link=topic=13649.msg159273#msg159273 date=1345783090] [quote author=imikhail link=topic=13649.msg159272#msg159272 date=1345782924] [quote author=minatasgeel link=topic=13649.msg159267#msg159267 date=1345776072] imikhail, are there specific madayeh for every sunday like you said before or NO????
Yes there are. Please check Al Kethare Alro7eya fee Madayeh All Kaneesa Alkebteya
who's the author?
The book itself has no specific author, it is one of the liturgical books. The madayeh are authored by various composers.
Albeir never said glorification could be done during communion. He even mentioned it is incorrect theology to honor saints during the time when Christ is physically present in his recent sermon on the glorification rite. I have no idea where you are getting this...
Imikhail,
I agree wholeheartedly with what you are saying and I back you up. The church, in her wisdom, has organized the rite of the distribution so that we can completely focus on Christ alone and meditate on the mystery of the sacrament.
Guys, we do praise God through His saints, don't we? ebraxis responses, abakran, Gospel responses (talking specifically about annual days), and by the way, in the same vein it's not strictly correct to say akseyas, or akseyos before agios.. oujai
I never said you cannot praise God through His saints. However, the church believes it is improper to praise God indirectly when He is physically present before us. Concerning the hymns during the liturgy (of the word)--Christ is not yet physically present so the argument still stands. By the way, the synaxarium was never (originally) said during the Liturgy of the Word--this is something relatively new; thereby, the hymns such as khen efran, apekran, and so on were not chanted.
P.S. I have yet to meet a bishop who agreed that it is ok to chant glorification hymns during communion.
[quote author=Amoussa01 link=topic=13649.msg159283#msg159283 date=1345788782] I never said you cannot praise God through His saints. However, the church believes it is improper to praise God indirectly when He is physically present before us. Concerning the hymns during the liturgy (of the word)--Christ is not yet physically present so the argument still stands. By the way, the synaxarium was never (originally) said during the Liturgy of the Word--this is something relatively new; thereby, the hymns such as khen efran, apekran, and so on were not chanted.
P.S. I have yet to meet a bishop who agreed that it is ok to chant glorification hymns during communion.
Dear Amousa
Excellent information regarding the Synexarium. Indeed, reading the Synexarium during the liturgy did not take place till mid to late 1800's.
Dear Amoussa1, I was actually addressing earlier posts not yours.. I agree with what you said. However in your very last post you imply that abakran is a recent introduction as well as khan ebran. No sir the latter shouldn't even be sung after the Synexarium.. oujai
Comments
[quote author=imikhail link=topic=13649.msg159245#msg159245 date=1345746040]
The time of communion should be dedicated to remembering our salvation through the sacrifice of which we are partaking.
During this time we should be medititating only on Christ and what He had done for our salvation.
Let me ask this question: would it be ok to do glorification to a saint during the holy 50 days during communion? If not, why not?
I'm confused, imikhail.
You said that melodies revolving around the gospel of the day should be prayed during the distribution, and you also said that the hymns prayed during the distribution should focus solely on Christ and salvation through the sacrifice we are partaking...
Also, can you provide an example of the hymns you believe more appropriate?
Thank you.
Dear Andrew,
The question I posted is a rhetorical question. I do not think anyone who understands a bit about rituals would agree to have glorification during communion.
Same thing during the special seasons like Great Lent, Palm Sunday, ...
Annual season is no different Glorification became common during this season because the psaltos usually run out of prayers to say or because they feel they need to pray something different.
However, it is not up to us to choose what to say or what not to say depending on our mood. We need to follow the church rites rather than our own whims.
imikhail, are there specific madayeh for every sunday like you said before or NO????
Yes there are. Please check Al Kethare Alro7eya fee Madayeh All Kaneesa Alkebteya
[quote author=minatasgeel link=topic=13649.msg159267#msg159267 date=1345776072]
imikhail, are there specific madayeh for every sunday like you said before or NO????
Yes there are. Please check Al Kethare Alro7eya fee Madayeh All Kaneesa Alkebteya
who's the author?
ReturnOrthodoxy
The Body of Christ is the Church - both militant and victorious. So when we praise a saint, we are praising the body of XC.
ReturnOrthodoxy
With all due respect RO, should we just do anything regardless of the proper rite just because it makes sense?
You are correct. To be honest, I did not read through the whole thing. I just wanted to point out that it made sense. I will go back, and read through the whole thing, and I'll try to figure it out. I was actually in the class with Albeir in which he said that communion is the proper time for glorification according to the old rite.
Pray for me,
ReturnOrthodoxy
Thanks
[quote author=imikhail link=topic=13649.msg159272#msg159272 date=1345782924]
[quote author=minatasgeel link=topic=13649.msg159267#msg159267 date=1345776072]
imikhail, are there specific madayeh for every sunday like you said before or NO????
Yes there are. Please check Al Kethare Alro7eya fee Madayeh All Kaneesa Alkebteya
who's the author?
The book itself has no specific author, it is one of the liturgical books. The madayeh are authored by various composers.
Albeir never said glorification could be done during communion. He even mentioned it is incorrect theology to honor saints during the time when Christ is physically present in his recent sermon on the glorification rite. I have no idea where you are getting this...
Imikhail,
I agree wholeheartedly with what you are saying and I back you up. The church, in her wisdom, has organized the rite of the distribution so that we can completely focus on Christ alone and meditate on the mystery of the sacrament.
we do praise God through His saints, don't we? ebraxis responses, abakran, Gospel responses (talking specifically about annual days), and by the way, in the same vein it's not strictly correct to say akseyas, or akseyos before agios..
oujai
P.S. I have yet to meet a bishop who agreed that it is ok to chant glorification hymns during communion.
I never said you cannot praise God through His saints. However, the church believes it is improper to praise God indirectly when He is physically present before us. Concerning the hymns during the liturgy (of the word)--Christ is not yet physically present so the argument still stands. By the way, the synaxarium was never (originally) said during the Liturgy of the Word--this is something relatively new; thereby, the hymns such as khen efran, apekran, and so on were not chanted.
P.S. I have yet to meet a bishop who agreed that it is ok to chant glorification hymns during communion.
Dear Amousa
Excellent information regarding the Synexarium. Indeed, reading the Synexarium during the liturgy did not take place till mid to late 1800's.
I was actually addressing earlier posts not yours.. I agree with what you said. However in your very last post you imply that abakran is a recent introduction as well as khan ebran. No sir the latter shouldn't even be sung after the Synexarium..
oujai