If you look at Ethiopia, we have resisted Islamic invasion many times. We are surrounded by Muslim nation, but we have survived. A Christian Island in the sea of Muslims. There are also many muslims in Ethiopia, but we have lived in peace for centuries. Ethiopia is actually were the first muslim people that were prosecuted in Saudi came and the king accepted them. The king too became a muslim.
That's why Mohammed wrote in the Koran that no Islamic nation shall invade Ethiopia or shall raise their sword on Ethiopia.
Well, in alexanderia it is similar the way the Coptic Church is at. It is surrounded by Muslim nation, but managed to survive till this day.
That is an excellent point. The Church in Ethiopia, as with the Church in Egypt, has borne a great witness to the Faith, and in both countries there has been a great revival of the Church in the face of great difficulties.
I 'm not sure what you meant by "revival" in the Ethiopian Orthodox Church. We were very weak at one time during the 16th century when the King Gragn Mohammed from the neighboring Somalia area invaded Ethiopia and the Ethiopian Orthodox Church (which were intermingled at the time ). With the help of the Portugese army, they were routed back.
But during about , I think 1000 a.d., there was also this queen with Jewish background who burned and killed priests like crazy. There is this story actually how this church of St. Mary, wouldn't burn when her army tried to burn it. So, she made the priests themselves burn the church.
But as to revival, perhaps you're talking about the numbers. We have about 40-45 million followers in Ethiopia, largest of all Oriental Orthodox Churches. We used to get our patriarch from Egypt until like 1959.
It is partly numbers, but also the way in which the Church has helped the nation recover from the revolutionary regime. It seems to me that the Ethiopian Church bears a great witness to the Faith.
[quote author=christiangrlforevr link=topic=4177.msg59441#msg59441 date=1156445899] Muslnms kill us because they think that we r kefara{sry dont kno the english transilition} Christians r very devoted to their beliefs. Muslims r 2 but their belief is just wrong.
~cgfe~
Wow... this is very interesting.
I heard (rumer--not sure yet) that there is going to be Anti-radical islam week coming up in the next week in around college campuses in the U.S. ... I guess in anniversary of 9/11 attack.
I don't understand many things in the Quran. I don't need to find out either. Me and God are good enough for me. lol
The difference between a Christian and a Muslim is this:
A CHRISTIAN WOULD SAY :"I WILL DIE FOR MY BELIEF" A MUSLIM WOULD SAY : "YOU WILL DIE FOR MY BELIEF".
So, now you want a christian to be more like a muslim? You want us to issue fatwas for those who say anything we dislike about our faith? You want us to prohibit other faiths from being practised? You wish us to terrorise other nations and kill people and threaten them if they don't become Christian?? You wish us to beat women ?? You wish us to have temporary marriages (Marriages of Pleasure) whenever we are away from our wifes ? You wish us to follow the example of the Islamic prophet Mohammed and submit to our desires and marry a woman against her will, or even divorce her from her husband so that we can marry her?? That's very strange, we follow the example of David in REPENTING for our sins when he submitted to his desire and lusted after a married woman. The Holy Spirit teaches us to be the EXACT opposite example of what Mohammed was.
You want us to marry kids at the age of 6?? and have sex with them at 9?? Like the Muslim Prophet?? You wish us to throw tantrums and protest in the street and threaten people whenever they say anything displeasing or hurtful of our faith??
Saint Mary appeared for us in Zeitoun, Our Lord Jesus Christ took the form of man and died for us on the Cross. We are living in God's grace and in His Love. Why ON EARTH would we give this up to be like a Muslim??
A CHRISTIAN WOULD SAY :"I WILL DIE FOR MY BELIEF" A MUSLIM WOULD SAY : "YOU WILL DIE FOR MY BELIEF".
Saint Mary appeared for us in Zeitoun, Our Lord Jesus Christ took the form of man and died for us on the Cross. We are living in God's grace and in His Love. Why ON EARTH would we give this up to be like a Muslim??
wow the part i highlighted is kind of true, for real. even though in Europe there were some violent christians... lol muslims... the reiligion was spread by the sword mostly.... now they are converting people .... especially the ones in jail.....african american community that are in jail..... they are converting them one by one. Those african Americans.... they have some resentment against the white man.....so they think Christianity is the religion of White people aka Europeans.... so........ they become Muslim. It's not bad either.... as long as they change their bad way of behaviour whatever reason they got in jail for.... lol.... but when they come out they might decide to be a good Muslim or a Terrorist Muslim. Hmmmm. God willing, there won't be no more bad behaviours. But what they don't know is that Christianity has been established since the first century A.D in Egypt and down to EThiopia. Even St. Mary was a refuge in Egypt for quite some time with baby Eyesus Kristos (Jesus Christ). Even in my country, some monks say she came to Ethiopia too.... but I don't believe it... they are just trying to take credit for what is not theirs or what God has planned for them. So, people should know the Africa (north East) is where Christianity prospered in the beginning. Africa is not just Muslims, Pagans, and Tribal bandits. lol
About the St. mary part, well.......... it is very interesting and there was a picture of her appearing in some church in Egypt. My uncle back in my homeland.... got it and gave it to us and it seems so real. Was it during the fasting season that ended just few weeks ago that she appeared? I want to know. But it is a miracle! lol
If possible I would like to read the full story of this miracle (with a thank you)
But during about , I think 1000 a.d., there was also this queen with Jewish background who burned and killed priests like crazy. There is this story actually how this church of St. Mary, wouldn't burn when her army tried to burn it. So, she made the priests themselves burn the church.
[quote author=CopticPete link=topic=4177.msg57959#msg57959 date=1153582309] Well that was the title of a very disturbing article i read. The article tries to say that muslims are more devout, and more unified than christains are, and in a way it is true. http://americandaily.com/article/14660 but still can u beleive someone would write that?
The reason that someone would write that is because they are most likely a devout Muslim. Note the authors name is Sara Ghorab. This article is propaganda plain and simple. She is making too many generalizations about Muslims and Christians.
[quote author=QT_PA_2T link=topic=4177.msg76576#msg76576 date=1189166929] The difference between a Christian and a Muslim is this:
A CHRISTIAN WOULD SAY :"I WILL DIE FOR MY BELIEF" A MUSLIM WOULD SAY : "YOU WILL DIE FOR MY BELIEF".
So, now you want a christian to be more like a muslim? You want us to issue fatwas for those who say anything we dislike about our faith? You want us to prohibit other faiths from being practised? You wish us to terrorise other nations and kill people and threaten them if they don't become Christian?? You wish us to beat women ?? You wish us to have temporary marriages (Marriages of Pleasure) whenever we are away from our wifes ? You wish us to follow the example of the Islamic prophet Mohammed and submit to our desires and marry a woman against her will, or even divorce her from her husband so that we can marry her?? That's very strange, we follow the example of David in REPENTING for our sins when he submitted to his desire and lusted after a married woman. The Holy Spirit teaches us to be the EXACT opposite example of what Mohammed was.
You want us to marry kids at the age of 6?? and have sex with them at 9?? Like the Muslim Prophet?? You wish us to throw tantrums and protest in the street and threaten people whenever they say anything displeasing or hurtful of our faith??
Saint Mary appeared for us in Zeitoun, Our Lord Jesus Christ took the form of man and died for us on the Cross. We are living in God's grace and in His Love. Why ON EARTH would we give this up to be like a Muslim??
May I just say that what I love most about being a Christian - especially Coptic is this:
Despite how many times my family in Egypt suffer because they are Coptic Christians, or even those I know, they have NEVER offended nor said anything wrong against anyone muslim. Perhaps we disagree with the Koran, - yes, it is ok to do this, but we definately love and respect muslims.
Spot on. They blow people up to show what their vision of God is - we love them to show what our vision is. Then they go wondering why they get a bad name? Of course, there are many millions of Muslims who don't hold with extremism - it is just we don't hear much from them - is that because they are afraid of being blown up too?
I agree, but Christianity does not have a very good record. The Inquisition, the numerous Crusades, the many schisms because of politics that resulted in persecution...
I had a debate with someone that was triggered by a remark he said about Catholics being terrorists. I thought he was just naive and extending a theme that began by the Reformed Churches and perhaps the notorious book, the Da Vinci Code. Instead, I was baffled at how much he knew about how terrible the Crusades were. How the Christians ate the dead Turks during the Siege of Ephesus, since they believed them to be subhuman! The Bishop of Rome was receiving unprecedented power in the West, and had not only advocated this atrocity, but assured the Christians that would go to heaven for killing Muslims. Some historians at the time, refused to describe the Christian atrocities at the day and instead sufficed to say that they were beyond anything imaginable.
That is a deplorable position, that we agree is not the essence of Christianity. However, we must remember that even Adolf Hitler used Christianity to employ his Darwanian philosophy.
If we are going to have serious talks with Muslims, we can not be naive that any religion can be exploited to the point of obscurity to gain political agenda. This is what we both agree. Thus, I think it is not good enough that we use these occasions and history to have a portrayal of Islam. Instead, I believe, we must examine the life of Muhammad and his followers- just as we ask our friends to look beyond history and see the life of Christ, the Apostles and the Martyrs.
I take your point, but the Crusades happened a thousand years ago, and it is a long time since the bad days of the Inquisition in the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries; if Muslims have to go that far back, they are, frankly, making debating points. We only have to go back to this morning's news.
Something has gone wrong with Islam. Christianity was not spread by the sword as Islam was. It is true that after St. Constantine made Christianity the state religion, the state used violence of its behalf; that was wrong. The last Pope apologised for excesses like the Crusades. Where are the leading Muslims condemning 9/11 and Osama (dye my beard) Laden? The Christian Churches have not used violence in years, and their leaders have apologised for the past; when Islam does the same we will have some equivalence- until then most of us will remain unimpressed by arguments that have to drag up things from a thousand years ago.
As for Hitler, he was profoundly anti Christian - as the number of Catholics and Lutherans in his concentration camps testified.
You cannot, in all fairness, compare Muhammad and Christ; the one was just a man with all a man's faults and sinful nature; the other was the Son of God and was without sin; that would be a terribly unfair comparison.
Compare the early Church and early Islam; the first persecuted and poor, making its way by conversions through the Spirit - the latter a mighty military force conquering in the name of Allah; very instructive, I'd say.
Comments
There are also many muslims in Ethiopia, but we have lived in peace for centuries.
Ethiopia is actually were the first muslim people that were prosecuted in Saudi came and the king accepted them. The king too became a muslim.
That's why Mohammed wrote in the Koran that no Islamic nation shall invade Ethiopia or shall raise their sword on Ethiopia.
Well, in alexanderia it is similar the way the Coptic Church is at. It is surrounded by Muslim nation, but managed to survive till this day.
In Christ,
Anglian
But during about , I think 1000 a.d., there was also this queen with Jewish background who burned and killed priests like crazy. There is this story actually how this church of St. Mary, wouldn't burn when her army tried to burn it. So, she made the priests themselves burn the church.
But as to revival, perhaps you're talking about the numbers. We have about 40-45 million followers in Ethiopia, largest of all Oriental Orthodox Churches. We used to get our patriarch from Egypt until like 1959.
In Christ,
Anglian
Muslnms kill us because they think that we r kefara{sry dont kno the english transilition}
Christians r very devoted to their beliefs. Muslims r 2 but their belief is just wrong.
~cgfe~
Wow... this is very interesting.
I heard (rumer--not sure yet) that there is going to be Anti-radical islam week coming up in the next week in around college campuses in the U.S. ... I guess in anniversary of 9/11 attack.
I don't understand many things in the Quran. I don't need to find out either. Me and God are good enough for me. lol
A CHRISTIAN WOULD SAY :"I WILL DIE FOR MY BELIEF"
A MUSLIM WOULD SAY : "YOU WILL DIE FOR MY BELIEF".
So, now you want a christian to be more like a muslim? You want us to issue fatwas for those who say anything we dislike about our faith? You want us to prohibit other faiths from being practised? You wish us to terrorise other nations and kill people and threaten them if they don't become Christian?? You wish us to beat women ?? You wish us to have temporary marriages (Marriages of Pleasure) whenever we are away from our wifes ? You wish us to follow the example of the Islamic prophet Mohammed and submit to our desires and marry a woman against her will, or even divorce her from her husband so that we can marry her?? That's very strange, we follow the example of David in REPENTING for our sins when he submitted to his desire and lusted after a married woman. The Holy Spirit teaches us to be the EXACT opposite example of what Mohammed was.
You want us to marry kids at the age of 6?? and have sex with them at 9?? Like the Muslim Prophet?? You wish us to throw tantrums and protest in the street and threaten people whenever they say anything displeasing or hurtful of our faith??
Saint Mary appeared for us in Zeitoun, Our Lord Jesus Christ took the form of man and died for us on the Cross. We are living in God's grace and in His Love. Why ON EARTH would we give this up to be like a Muslim??
A CHRISTIAN WOULD SAY :"I WILL DIE FOR MY BELIEF"
A MUSLIM WOULD SAY : "YOU WILL DIE FOR MY BELIEF".
Saint Mary appeared for us in Zeitoun, Our Lord Jesus Christ took the form of man and died for us on the Cross. We are living in God's grace and in His Love. Why ON EARTH would we give this up to be like a Muslim??
wow the part i highlighted is kind of true, for real. even though in Europe there were some violent christians... lol
muslims... the reiligion was spread by the sword mostly.... now they are converting people .... especially the ones in jail.....african american community that are in jail..... they are converting them one by one. Those african Americans.... they have some resentment against the white man.....so they think Christianity is the religion of White people aka Europeans.... so........ they become Muslim. It's not bad either.... as long as they change their bad way of behaviour whatever reason they got in jail for.... lol.... but when they come out they might decide to be a good Muslim or a Terrorist Muslim. Hmmmm. God willing, there won't be no more bad behaviours. But what they don't know is that Christianity has been established since the first century A.D in Egypt and down to EThiopia. Even St. Mary was a refuge in Egypt for quite some time with baby Eyesus Kristos (Jesus Christ). Even in my country, some monks say she came to Ethiopia too.... but I don't believe it... they are just trying to take credit for what is not theirs or what God has planned for them.
So, people should know the Africa (north East) is where Christianity prospered in the beginning. Africa is not just Muslims, Pagans, and Tribal bandits. lol
About the St. mary part, well.......... it is very interesting and there was a picture of her appearing in some church in Egypt. My uncle back in my homeland.... got it and gave it to us and it seems so real. Was it during the fasting season that ended just few weeks ago that she appeared? I want to know. But it is a miracle! lol
Adios!
http://www.zeitun-eg.org/
If possible I would like to read the full story of this miracle (with a thank you)
Well that was the title of a very disturbing article i read. The article tries to say that muslims are more devout, and more unified than christains are, and in a way it is true.
http://americandaily.com/article/14660
but still can u beleive someone would write that?
The reason that someone would write that is because they are most likely a devout Muslim. Note the authors name is Sara Ghorab.
This article is propaganda plain and simple. She is making too many generalizations about Muslims and Christians.
The difference between a Christian and a Muslim is this:
A CHRISTIAN WOULD SAY :"I WILL DIE FOR MY BELIEF"
A MUSLIM WOULD SAY : "YOU WILL DIE FOR MY BELIEF".
So, now you want a christian to be more like a muslim? You want us to issue fatwas for those who say anything we dislike about our faith? You want us to prohibit other faiths from being practised? You wish us to terrorise other nations and kill people and threaten them if they don't become Christian?? You wish us to beat women ?? You wish us to have temporary marriages (Marriages of Pleasure) whenever we are away from our wifes ? You wish us to follow the example of the Islamic prophet Mohammed and submit to our desires and marry a woman against her will, or even divorce her from her husband so that we can marry her?? That's very strange, we follow the example of David in REPENTING for our sins when he submitted to his desire and lusted after a married woman. The Holy Spirit teaches us to be the EXACT opposite example of what Mohammed was.
You want us to marry kids at the age of 6?? and have sex with them at 9?? Like the Muslim Prophet?? You wish us to throw tantrums and protest in the street and threaten people whenever they say anything displeasing or hurtful of our faith??
Saint Mary appeared for us in Zeitoun, Our Lord Jesus Christ took the form of man and died for us on the Cross. We are living in God's grace and in His Love. Why ON EARTH would we give this up to be like a Muslim??
You're the man.
Despite how many times my family in Egypt suffer because they are Coptic Christians, or even those I know, they have NEVER offended nor said anything wrong against anyone muslim. Perhaps we disagree with the Koran, - yes, it is ok to do this, but we definately love and respect muslims.
Spot on. They blow people up to show what their vision of God is - we love them to show what our vision is. Then they go wondering why they get a bad name? Of course, there are many millions of Muslims who don't hold with extremism - it is just we don't hear much from them - is that because they are afraid of being blown up too?
In Christ,
Anglian
I had a debate with someone that was triggered by a remark he said about Catholics being terrorists. I thought he was just naive and extending a theme that began by the Reformed Churches and perhaps the notorious book, the Da Vinci Code. Instead, I was baffled at how much he knew about how terrible the Crusades were. How the Christians ate the dead Turks during the Siege of Ephesus, since they believed them to be subhuman! The Bishop of Rome was receiving unprecedented power in the West, and had not only advocated this atrocity, but assured the Christians that would go to heaven for killing Muslims. Some historians at the time, refused to describe the Christian atrocities at the day and instead sufficed to say that they were beyond anything imaginable.
That is a deplorable position, that we agree is not the essence of Christianity. However, we must remember that even Adolf Hitler used Christianity to employ his Darwanian philosophy.
If we are going to have serious talks with Muslims, we can not be naive that any religion can be exploited to the point of obscurity to gain political agenda. This is what we both agree. Thus, I think it is not good enough that we use these occasions and history to have a portrayal of Islam. Instead, I believe, we must examine the life of Muhammad and his followers- just as we ask our friends to look beyond history and see the life of Christ, the Apostles and the Martyrs.
I take your point, but the Crusades happened a thousand years ago, and it is a long time since the bad days of the Inquisition in the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries; if Muslims have to go that far back, they are, frankly, making debating points. We only have to go back to this morning's news.
Something has gone wrong with Islam. Christianity was not spread by the sword as Islam was. It is true that after St. Constantine made Christianity the state religion, the state used violence of its behalf; that was wrong. The last Pope apologised for excesses like the Crusades. Where are the leading Muslims condemning 9/11 and Osama (dye my beard) Laden? The Christian Churches have not used violence in years, and their leaders have apologised for the past; when Islam does the same we will have some equivalence- until then most of us will remain unimpressed by arguments that have to drag up things from a thousand years ago.
As for Hitler, he was profoundly anti Christian - as the number of Catholics and Lutherans in his concentration camps testified.
You cannot, in all fairness, compare Muhammad and Christ; the one was just a man with all a man's faults and sinful nature; the other was the Son of God and was without sin; that would be a terribly unfair comparison.
Compare the early Church and early Islam; the first persecuted and poor, making its way by conversions through the Spirit - the latter a mighty military force conquering in the name of Allah; very instructive, I'd say.
In Christ,
Anglian