love

torab

is there something like love?
i am just wondering...cause...i dont know how to explain....i am not in love...or am i?
i am really confused...i think i love someone...but i am not sure aboutz that...cause the church or maYBE THE PARENTHOD say that there is no love without god...but how about the people living in europe...like me?....i mean in egypt its easy...cause there they get ingaged and have the way of living there like u getting ingaged and then married....but in europe? if someone likes somone here.....its difficult...cause they are not coptic and have not the way of life like in egypt....they need to et baptised and so on....but what if there is a coptic guy loving a non coptic girl and....i dont know....how it gonna work....
do u get it?
i hope so....
please respond as soon as posible
hope u gonna give me advices
gbu

ophadece

Dear aripsalin,
No, there is no love without Christ (as you right said, or as parents rightly usually say). If you find yourself loving a non-Coptic, or someone from the same sex, this is not love. This is desire. And desire becomes a sin if one is attracted and pulled without true faith, or without God being in that kind of desire. Certain desires come from instinct and they are not wrong if they are utilised in the right way. Hunger is an instinct; sex is an instinct. So don't be attracted by the desire without direction from God or the Holy Spirit.
Another point based on this is that Satan can very easily use those instincts to form up a desire and attract us away from the love of God, and the rationale of living in union with Him. So be careful and watchful.
I don't really think that it is necessarily easy in Egypt when someone loves another one (because there are many sins out of desires still, and because of other reasons love doesn't grow; well, I might even say that even Christians in Egypt don't believe in love at all). It just seems you haven't lived in Egypt at all, or might have moved to Europe since you were very young.
God bless you and mention me in your prayers

Anglican

Dear Αριψαλιν ,

What Ophadece offers is wise advice.

It is very hard for young Copts who have been brought up in the west; the culture there can be very different, and one's parents, brought up in a Coptic culture can also find it hard dealing with a child who has been exposed to very different influences.

The west makes an idol of 'being in love'; the west also has a very high divorce rate; this is no accident. We fall in love in a passion; passions do not always last. What do we when the passion fades a little - give in to the next one? That is, indeed, what often happens in the west, where divorce and remarriage are a way of life for many. So, the first thing is to ask whether you want to follow this model for your life?

When a Christian loves a non-Christian, the difficulties that arise are many; she may find she has no understanding or desire to understand what is the most important part of your life; in the first passion of 'love' that won't matter to you - it will later. Indeed, so much so that many 'mixed' marriages fail on just that point. Of course, it may be that you are fortunate, and that the object of your love will be interested and even drawn to the Church by you; but it it does not, you are storing up big trouble down the line.

Your parents may find it hard to understand some of the things going on in your mind, because the culture you live in is different from the one they grew up in; but look at them - then look at some of your western friends' parents and ask yourself which way you want to go?

Yes, maybe you do love this girl. If you really do, you will have the respect for her to talk about your religion with her and see how she reacts; you will also respect her enough to talk to your parents about her. If you can't do either of these things then it is passion rather than real love you are feeling - and Ophadece's advice is spot on.

I hope that helps a bit.

In Christ,

Anglian

torab

thank u two...
i just wanted to say that my father is/was a non-coptic...he is/was an european....
my mother is from egypt...and my sister and i were batised coptic and i am really thankful for that that god gave us the mercy the blessing to be coptic orthodox!
i love our church so much...and i am really thankful for ur advices!

again...thank u...
for more advices it makes me happy
gbu
pray for me

Anglican

Dear Αριψαλιν,

I am glad that our words helped.

You clearly have a blessing in your parents, and from them an example of how mixed marriages can work well. It means that they will have a real understanding if you can talk to them about the girl you think you love.

You also have the great blessing of the Church, where you will always find a treasury of wisdom. You know how we should behave to each other, and that we should walk in the way of Our Saviour; in our dealings with each other we show whose children we are. If you continue along the road you have - that is to seek advice and to be aware of the potential problems - and to pray, you will not go wrong. One of the sad things in the west is to look around at young people who do not have this guidance and support, and to see how easily they can go wrong.

May His blessings be upon you as you go forward with this.

In Christ,

Anglian

ophadece

Dear aripsalin,
I strongly agree with what anglian said, and I would like to enforce a point here of what he said. Yes, you are very lucky, and yes, I think you are very well-mannered, and may God always protect you. It is the point that you try always not to look at others living around you, and imitate them, because they are not a role example at all, and this is proved by the high percentage of divorce and remarriage (and civil partnerships as well). Walk strongly in faith, and please pray for me that I do as well: please.
God bless you all and mention me in your prayers

torab

thank u all of u...u all really helped me....
god bless u all
pray for me

Unknown

[quote author=ophadece link=topic=5284.msg70689#msg70689 date=1178545400]
Dear aripsalin,
No, there is no love without Christ (as you right said, or as parents rightly usually say). If you find yourself loving a non-Coptic, or someone from the same sex, this is not love. This is desire. And desire becomes a sin if one is attracted and pulled without true faith, or without God being in that kind of desire. Certain desires come from instinct and they are not wrong if they are utilised in the right way. Hunger is an instinct; sex is an instinct. So don't be attracted by the desire without direction from God or the Holy Spirit.
Another point based on this is that Satan can very easily use those instincts to form up a desire and attract us away from the love of God, and the rationale of living in union with Him. So be careful and watchful.
I don't really think that it is necessarily easy in Egypt when someone loves another one (because there are many sins out of desires still, and because of other reasons love doesn't grow; well, I might even say that even Christians in Egypt don't believe in love at all). It just seems you haven't lived in Egypt at all, or might have moved to Europe since you were very young.
God bless you and mention me in your prayers


Ophadece,

I agree with what u said, but would it be wrong then to be friends with people that are not Christian? Perhaps being their friends they can know Christ? Not sure...

What do u think?

Anglican

Dear QT,

I think it is fine for us to have friends who are not Orthodox; we live in a world which is not Orthodox, and by the witness we each bear to our Faith, others can come to a view of it.

One of the many good things about this site is that I think that those who come to it from outside the Church get a good view of what we are like - the good and the bad bits. But I like to think that overall, there are far more of the former than the latter.

In Christ,

Anglian