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Question Related to the Devil

PopeKyrillosPopeKyrillos
edited December 1969 in Faith Issues
So when reading the topic "Kingdom of the devil", I thought of a new question, but i didn't want to steal the other thread. Anyways, my question is I know that the devil cannot in anyway repent, and wouldn't want to, and had to be cast out of heaven into hell. But even after the devil sinned, why does god make the devil tempt us? So for ex. God created angels and humans perfect. But if a person were to sin, how come he is not cast into hell tempting other people?

PK

Comments

  • gregorytheSinnergregorytheSinner
    I dont kno if this will answer your full question but here goes

    The devil was the first person since creation to sin.  He was created perfect at a time were only perfectness existed.  Pride was the first sin to enter the world, when he decieded to overthrow God and make himself higher.  Of course we know what happened and he got booted to hell.  Then Adam and Eve came along, were God gave thm a chance at living perfeclty, but even they sinned and were booted to earthly toil and labor.  NOtice God's mercy towards them because of the differnce of sins.
    Everyonoe in the world sins because of hte devil.  The diff here is, that some people choose to affiliate themselves with satan while others repent so they can affiliate themselves with God.  The ones who affiliate themselves iwth satan, end up serving as "tempters" to Gods Children.  However bad they may be, God still doens't condem them to Hell, becaue he is merciful and wants the Sinner to Repent and Live not Die.
  • Unknown
    The answer is simple, freedom and choice. God wants us to love Him with freedom and by choice.

    God did not make Satan tempt us; He cursed the serpent in Genesis, and in Job we see that Satan went to God to ask to tempt Job. But He allowed it in the beginning because love should be voluntary.

    Secondly, Satan did not just sin and that is the end of it; they had a time to choose the allegiance, and after that time their fate was sealed.

    We also have a time, which is our time as sojourners on this earth.
  • Anglican
    Thomas is quite correct.

    The Devil, full of pride and sure that he knows what is best, tempts us to emulate him; how often do we behave just that way?

    God has given us, His children, free will. Through the Incarnation He has shown us what it is to be really human in the way we are meant to be. Our Lord's will was always at one with the will of the Father; our will should be. Our Lord's love was unconditional and He was without sin; this too we should aspire to.

    It is wrong to say that God allows the Devil to tempt us; we allow him in - when we should be allowing in the perfect love of Him who died that we should have life eternal.

    In Christ,

    Anglian
  • Unknown
    [quote author=Anglian link=topic=5946.msg79523#msg79523 date=1195560286]
    It is wrong to say that God allows the Devil to tempt us; we allow him in - when we should be allowing in the perfect love of Him who died that we should have life eternal.


    Amen.
  • mikeforjesusmikeforjesus
    stop lying!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    it is not wrong to say God allows the devil to tempt us... He does! but we have the capability to resist.. and not accept his evil thoughts..

    it is wrong to say that God allows the devil to corrupt us..





  • Unknown
    He is talking about temptation differently; that as much as he allows temptation to occur, the reason we are tempted is because we are tempted--> we have a rebellious thought, or that something is enticing about the sin we are tempted with and thus the temptation is an actual temptation since it plays on a desire that is deep-seated. Thus, it is ultimately us that allows temptation sense we have something impure to be tempted of.

    For instance the desire to cheat might mean that you want to achieve with little effort. If we had a resolve to always achieve with solid work, and not be satisfied with disproportionate effort, then the temptation to cheat would not be a real temptation....

    Does that make sense?
  • Anglican
    There's an interesting discussion underlying this.

    When it is said that God 'allows' the Devil to tempt us, that is true only at the level that God allows the Devil (and us) to exist. God allows us free-will. We choose whether to fall for the temptation. As sinful men and women we, naturally, seek to place the blame elsewhere.

    We have to accept that it is we who sin. Let us not be like Adam, and blame Eve, or like Eve and blame the serpent. No one 'makes' us sin; we choose to do so, deliberately, through weakness and through our own deliberate fault.

    Let us place the blame for sinful behaviour - on us.

    In Christ,

    Anglian
  • Unknown
    I do feel like the perspective of DT and Anglian are missing the mark a little.

    There is certainly a sense in which God permits the devil to tempt us, and it is much more specific than Anglian's above reply would allow for. I think a cursory reading of the Life and sayings of St Antony or even the lives of the prophets David and Job will reveal that God indeed allows the devil to tempt us--at times even expressly. The Fathers account for a number of reasons as to why this is so; the two main ones are: 1) that we may have a share in Christ's defeat of evil, and hence the glory of His ultimate victory, and 2) that we may be strengthened in virtue.
  • Anglican
    Dear Iqbal,

    You make an interesting and pertinent point.

    Is there a difference between what God allows to the Saints and the experience of the rest of us?

    Is there, in short, a difference between God allowing Job to be tested by the Devil, and my succumbing to the temptation to avoid the fast?

    In Christ,

    Anglian
  • Unknown
    God does not tempt us. However, I take your point. I think, correct me if I am wrong, God allows temptation as much as we can handle. But sometimes in periods of pride, He allows it to be greater (Satan is only willing, and has been vieing for the chance).

    I remember a lecture on Chastity; that it was an exclusive, God-given gift- and that God takes it away from us if we thought us pious or righteous of our own merit. In think, God takes away the grace...and allows for temptation. But I don't think this means any collaboration with the Devil, but an expressed permission after the persistent requests of Satan?

    Am I grasping at straws?
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