Before, I think, we try to fight against something, it is useful to try to define what it is. This might prevent us from fighting phantoms, and overtiring ourselves.
Pride is one of those things that we all hate. We dislike to be shrugged off by men, or looked down on, and seeing the ridiculous slant of the crocked nose of arrogant men. But, only in Christianity is pride actually a vice, and not just a vice mind you- but THE vice. Most people do not think they are guilty of it, but Christians, however, are all to aware that pride is like this cancer that spreads and spoils every good thing in us. Not only that but it feels, when we are aware at least, to be this heavy weight that mercilessly pulls us down. Name any sin: unshastity, anger, greed, fickleness, drunkeness- they are all like fleabites in comparison (to steal a quote from Lewis).
It is Pride that somehow leads us to where nothing else could, to every vice and is what we call the antithesis of God.
One way that was suggested on how to assess your pride, ask yourself, "How much do I dislike it when other people treat me poorly, refuse to notice me, or patronise me, or show off?" It seems that we are in competition with everyone else's pride.
Unlike the other vices, like Greed, Lust, Anger, Gluttony, Envy and Sloth, it seems that Pride has a knack of being competetive. It desires more than everyone else. I like how Lewis describes it: Pride gets no pleasure out of having something, only out of having more of it than the next man. We say that people are proud of being rich, or clever, or good-looking, but they are not. They are proud of being richer, or cleverer, or better looking than others. If everyone was as rich, smart or handsome, there would be nothing to be proud about.
Pride leads you to other sins. A proud man might not just get greedy, but will try to make his competitors crumble- even by illegitimate means. A proud man might not just lust after a girl, but might even steal her from someone, just to prove himself better than other man.
Unlike the other vices, which may even bring people together, Pride=Enmity.
There are a few things we must not misunderstand about Pride. -Pleasure in being praised is not Pride. If you take pleasure in the fact you have pleased someone, that is great. In fact, Christ will tell us, "Well done, faithful servant...". What is the problem is thinking that you are thus a better person than others for having done it. - Pride in other people, is not "pride"- well, atleast not the sinful sort. We are proud of our Church, of the Cross, of our heritage etc. It really is an admiration- and it usually is only a sin when you think that you are thus the better person then everyone else because of it. - Our Pride is not in competition with God's- In fact He is not proud. He just is the Ideal. He wants you to know Him, and thus if you let go of your dignity, you might actually accept His Blood and seek the Kingdom with earnest. -Humility is not that guy at school, who sins and just says, "I am a nobody"
The humble person is like Moses- a leader, a man who did not think about others but his fellow countrymen.
Greetings! Clay has explained it pretty well. Here's some Biblical quotes on the subject:
Proverbs 11:2 When pride comes, then comes shame; But with the humble is wisdom.
Proverbs 13:10 By pride comes nothing but strife, But with the well-advised is wisdom.
Proverbs 16:18 Pride goes before destruction, And a haughty spirit before a fall.
Proverbs 29:23 A man’s pride will bring him low, But the humble in spirit will retain honor.
Jeremiah 13:15 [ Pride Precedes Captivity ] Hear and give ear: Do not be proud, For the LORD has spoken.
Jeremiah 49:16 Your fierceness has deceived you, The pride of your heart, O you who dwell in the clefts of the rock, Who hold the height of the hill! Though you make your nest as high as the eagle, I will bring you down from there,” says the LORD.
James 4:1 [ Pride Promotes Strife ] Where do wars and fights come from among you? Do they not come from your desires for pleasure that war in your members?
Mark 7:20-23 And He said, “What comes out of a man, that defiles a man. For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lewdness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness. All these evil things come from within and defile a man.”
Pride stands at the face of the Great Two Commandments, in which all the rest hang: (1) You shall love your God, with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind. (2) You shall love one another.
When you try to practice righteousness, and try to draw closer to God, you should find that you really are nothing.
Do you know before Christ, this great moral teacher in Greek Wisdom, Socrates, believed that we can attain virtue by mere thinking and meditating. That ultimately failed. St. Paul to St. Augustine realised that virtue really is a "gift of God" a "fruit of the Holy Spirit".
What I am trying to say is, without God, we cannot attain it. If you struggle for it, and be faithful in the struggle, God will know you want humility, and give it to you freely. He wants to give it to you. But, He makes us struggle.
Why? We are like Bodybuilders- our muscles grow with resistance and persistence. There is this beautiful verse: "we also glory in tribulations, knowing that tribulation produces perseverance, and perseverance, character, and character , hope" (Rom. 5:3)
I think there are many things the Orthodox Church offers to us repentant Proud people, - The Sacrament of Repentance. Making a self-inventory and consistent self-examination - The Sacrament of Confession. Having your sins exposed, and out of the festering darkness, displayed in the light, where things can finally be worked on. - The Sacrament of Holy Communion. When you look at the Bread, think about being that Jew in the Old Testament, who had to slaughter the BEST cow every time they sinned. And not only that, they had to do it in front of everyone. And, wait for it, they had to remember while they were slitting the animals throat, that its life was instead of his own. - Talk freely about your less personal struggles with your Christian friends, and maybe more personal ones with a trusted Christian elder. - Think less about yourself, and more about others. This needs practice- by God, He knows how hard it is! I feel like a beginner every time I go to Confession, and realise how self-conceited I am.
My father of confession once told me that one way to avoid pride and try to gain humility is by constantly reminding ourselves that we are NOTHING WITHOUT God. That way we realize that we should not have pride in ourselves or rely on our on abilities, but instead completely trust in God.
In my own life I spent many years thinking that if only I could get my act together and really force myself to be a better Christian then I could. I realise now that this was prideful, even while I was well aware of my sins. I also ame to think that all of the things God wanted for me to be doing, and many more that I thought were good but were not his will, could al be achieved if I organised myself.
I have now learned a liberating lesson. God does not need me. I am not the Saviour of the world. He asks me to work with him in his own work and promises to give all that I need to perform all that he asks.
Now I can pray, 'Lord if you want me to pray the Agpeya regularly you are going to have to give me the grace I need because I can't do it in my own strength, and even if I could it would be just words not prayer'. 'Lord, if you want me to preach this Sunday then you are going to have to give me the grace I need because I can't do it in my own strength, and even if I could it would be just my words and not yours'.
And when I accomplish something I pray, 'Lord, you have accomplished this in my life through your grace, to you be all the glory'.
And when I sin, I pray, 'Lord you already know what I am like. It is no surprise to you. If you want me to change my life then give me the grace to repent and to life as you will, without your grace I can achieve nothing'.
There is no room for pride if we always seek God's strength and grace at all moments of our lives. Not just for big things but for spending the day at work or at school. If we acknowledge that all the good that we see in our lives is of God then we give him all the praise. More than that, we can rejoice with others when they see God at work in their lives, rather than feeling that their success is a cause for our sorrow. If our hearts are darkened then we cannot will the light into existence, but God gives grace and light, and it is by focusing on God, not on our sin, that we drive the darkness away, or rather the light of God, which he freely gives to those who ask, drives away all darkness. But I have found I must focus on the light and not the darkness. The more that I am present to God and God is present to me the less scope there is for pride.
[quote author=Lostsinner link=topic=7532.msg99152#msg99152 date=1231614201] How do we kill our pride? how do we keep ourselves from thinking prideful thoughts and what are some spiritual exercises that we can benefit from
One way is to never forget your sins. I think Christ wants us to pray to him in humility as He asked us to say ".. forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those.."
So, even Christ wants us to remember our sins in fact; that none of us are perfect. I think it is when you forget your sins that you tend to become self righteous which is frowned in God's eyes.
Comments
Before, I think, we try to fight against something, it is useful to try to define what it is. This might prevent us from fighting phantoms, and overtiring ourselves.
Pride is one of those things that we all hate. We dislike to be shrugged off by men, or looked down on, and seeing the ridiculous slant of the crocked nose of arrogant men. But, only in Christianity is pride actually a vice, and not just a vice mind you- but THE vice. Most people do not think they are guilty of it, but Christians, however, are all to aware that pride is like this cancer that spreads and spoils every good thing in us. Not only that but it feels, when we are aware at least, to be this heavy weight that mercilessly pulls us down. Name any sin: unshastity, anger, greed, fickleness, drunkeness- they are all like fleabites in comparison (to steal a quote from Lewis).
It is Pride that somehow leads us to where nothing else could, to every vice and is what we call the antithesis of God.
One way that was suggested on how to assess your pride, ask yourself, "How much do I dislike it when other people treat me poorly, refuse to notice me, or patronise me, or show off?" It seems that we are in competition with everyone else's pride.
Unlike the other vices, like Greed, Lust, Anger, Gluttony, Envy and Sloth, it seems that Pride has a knack of being competetive. It desires more than everyone else. I like how Lewis describes it:
Pride gets no pleasure out of having something, only out of having more of it than the next man. We say that people are proud of being rich, or clever, or good-looking, but they are not. They are proud of being richer, or cleverer, or better looking than others. If everyone was as rich, smart or handsome, there would be nothing to be proud about.
Pride leads you to other sins. A proud man might not just get greedy, but will try to make his competitors crumble- even by illegitimate means. A proud man might not just lust after a girl, but might even steal her from someone, just to prove himself better than other man.
Unlike the other vices, which may even bring people together, Pride=Enmity.
There are a few things we must not misunderstand about Pride.
-Pleasure in being praised is not Pride. If you take pleasure in the fact you have pleased someone, that is great. In fact, Christ will tell us, "Well done, faithful servant...". What is the problem is thinking that you are thus a better person than others for having done it.
- Pride in other people, is not "pride"- well, atleast not the sinful sort. We are proud of our Church, of the Cross, of our heritage etc. It really is an admiration- and it usually is only a sin when you think that you are thus the better person then everyone else because of it.
- Our Pride is not in competition with God's- In fact He is not proud. He just is the Ideal. He wants you to know Him, and thus if you let go of your dignity, you might actually accept His Blood and seek the Kingdom with earnest.
-Humility is not that guy at school, who sins and just says, "I am a nobody"
The humble person is like Moses- a leader, a man who did not think about others but his fellow countrymen.
(Read more in 'Mere Christianity' by C.S. Lewis)
Clay has explained it pretty well. Here's some Biblical quotes on the subject:
Proverbs 11:2
When pride comes, then comes shame; But with the humble is wisdom.
Proverbs 13:10
By pride comes nothing but strife, But with the well-advised is wisdom.
Proverbs 16:18
Pride goes before destruction, And a haughty spirit before a fall.
Proverbs 29:23
A man’s pride will bring him low, But the humble in spirit will retain honor.
Jeremiah 13:15
[ Pride Precedes Captivity ] Hear and give ear: Do not be proud, For the LORD has spoken.
Jeremiah 49:16
Your fierceness has deceived you, The pride of your heart, O you who dwell in the clefts of the rock, Who hold the height of the hill! Though you make your nest as high as the eagle, I will bring you down from there,” says the LORD.
James 4:1
[ Pride Promotes Strife ] Where do wars and fights come from among you? Do they not come from your desires for pleasure that war in your members?
Mark 7:20-23
And He said, “What comes out of a man, that defiles a man. For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lewdness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness. All these evil things come from within and defile a man.”
God bless,
rpm
When you try to practice righteousness, and try to draw closer to God, you should find that you really are nothing.
Do you know before Christ, this great moral teacher in Greek Wisdom, Socrates, believed that we can attain virtue by mere thinking and meditating. That ultimately failed. St. Paul to St. Augustine realised that virtue really is a "gift of God" a "fruit of the Holy Spirit".
What I am trying to say is, without God, we cannot attain it. If you struggle for it, and be faithful in the struggle, God will know you want humility, and give it to you freely. He wants to give it to you. But, He makes us struggle.
Why? We are like Bodybuilders- our muscles grow with resistance and persistence. There is this beautiful verse: "we also glory in tribulations, knowing that tribulation produces perseverance, and perseverance, character, and character , hope" (Rom. 5:3)
I think there are many things the Orthodox Church offers to us repentant Proud people,
- The Sacrament of Repentance. Making a self-inventory and consistent self-examination
- The Sacrament of Confession. Having your sins exposed, and out of the festering darkness, displayed in the light, where things can finally be worked on.
- The Sacrament of Holy Communion. When you look at the Bread, think about being that Jew in the Old Testament, who had to slaughter the BEST cow every time they sinned. And not only that, they had to do it in front of everyone. And, wait for it, they had to remember while they were slitting the animals throat, that its life was instead of his own.
- Talk freely about your less personal struggles with your Christian friends, and maybe more personal ones with a trusted Christian elder.
- Think less about yourself, and more about others. This needs practice- by God, He knows how hard it is! I feel like a beginner every time I go to Confession, and realise how self-conceited I am.
Some good references:
(1) Fr Antonios thoughts of Humility
http://www.stbishoy.org.au/modules/wordpress/2007/07/26/some-thoughts-on-humility/
(2) Fr Antonios thoughts on Arrogance
http://www.stbishoy.org.au/modules/wordpress/2007/07/31/arrogance/
(3) For the self-examination Guide
http://www.orthodoxsermons.org/dmdocuments/Handout-GuidetoDailySelf-evaluation.pdf
(4) Some sermons
http://www.orthodoxsermons.org/index.php?option=com_docman&task=cat_view&gid=200&Itemid=26
(5) On Humility
http://www.orthodoxsermons.org/index.php?option=com_docman&task=search_result&Itemid=&search_phrase=Be+Clothed+With+Humility&search_mode=phrase
Hope this helps!
In Christ.
Also, if you are fighting lust, I think you may find this webpage helpful:
http://www.stbishoy.org.au/modules/wordpress/purity-by-fr-antonios/
I have now learned a liberating lesson. God does not need me. I am not the Saviour of the world. He asks me to work with him in his own work and promises to give all that I need to perform all that he asks.
Now I can pray, 'Lord if you want me to pray the Agpeya regularly you are going to have to give me the grace I need because I can't do it in my own strength, and even if I could it would be just words not prayer'. 'Lord, if you want me to preach this Sunday then you are going to have to give me the grace I need because I can't do it in my own strength, and even if I could it would be just my words and not yours'.
And when I accomplish something I pray, 'Lord, you have accomplished this in my life through your grace, to you be all the glory'.
And when I sin, I pray, 'Lord you already know what I am like. It is no surprise to you. If you want me to change my life then give me the grace to repent and to life as you will, without your grace I can achieve nothing'.
There is no room for pride if we always seek God's strength and grace at all moments of our lives. Not just for big things but for spending the day at work or at school. If we acknowledge that all the good that we see in our lives is of God then we give him all the praise. More than that, we can rejoice with others when they see God at work in their lives, rather than feeling that their success is a cause for our sorrow. If our hearts are darkened then we cannot will the light into existence, but God gives grace and light, and it is by focusing on God, not on our sin, that we drive the darkness away, or rather the light of God, which he freely gives to those who ask, drives away all darkness. But I have found I must focus on the light and not the darkness. The more that I am present to God and God is present to me the less scope there is for pride.
As ever
Peter
How do we kill our pride? how do we keep ourselves from thinking prideful thoughts and what are some spiritual exercises that we can benefit from
One way is to never forget your sins.
I think Christ wants us to pray to him in humility as He asked us to say ".. forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those.."
So, even Christ wants us to remember our sins in fact; that none of us are perfect. I think it is when you forget your sins that you tend to become self righteous which is frowned in God's eyes.