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Egyptian Presidential Elections
I am curious as to who many of you are supporting for the Egyptian Presidency in 2011? I know that Mamdouh Ramzi is a Copt and is running for the presidency. But do you think that he has a chance because he is Copt no matter how hard he tries to state that his religion will not influence his politics?
Or, if a Copt cannot be elected due to discrimination, would it be preferential to have someone like El-Sayyed El-Badawi of the New Wafd Party or an independent like Mohamed ElBaradei?
Plus which candidate seems best to help address the discrimination of the Coptic community?
Or, if a Copt cannot be elected due to discrimination, would it be preferential to have someone like El-Sayyed El-Badawi of the New Wafd Party or an independent like Mohamed ElBaradei?
Plus which candidate seems best to help address the discrimination of the Coptic community?
Comments
I am curious as to who many of you are supporting for the Egyptian Presidency in 2011? I know that Mamdouh Ramzi is a Copt and is running for the presidency. But do you think that he has a chance because he is Copt no matter how hard he tries to state that his religion will not influence his politics?
Or, if a Copt cannot be elected due to discrimination, would it be preferential to have someone like El-Sayyed El-Badawi of the New Wafd Party or an independent like Mohamed ElBaradei?
Plus which candidate seems best to help address the discrimination of the Coptic community?
well i think that they first need to admit that the Coptic Christians are in fact discriminated against.....which none of them is doing.
There are no Presidential Elections in Egypt.
Mubarak will win with 99% of the vote.
There are no Presidential Elections in Egypt.
Mubarak will win with 99% of the vote.
No President in Egypt has won with less than 95% of the vote.
There are no Presidential Elections in Egypt.
The Presidency of Egypt is a modified monarchy.
Changes can occur in Egypt either peacefully or violently (cf. the assassination of Anwar Sadat in 1981). Do not always assume that change cannot or will not come.
Ok, let's go over some statistics:
There are 3 or 4 Presidents of Egypt since the military coup of 1954. Sometimes Mohammad Naguib is mentioned, sometimes not.
Nasser President until heart attack.
Sadat President until assasination.
Mubarak, president since 1981 (that's 29 years and counting).
Mubarak allowed a plebicide of 95% once in order to allow the Americans to think that there was a real election.
The American State Department knows it is complete falsehood but allows the sham to somehow give a picture to the American Public, which is so gullable that they have bought the Brooklyn Bridge 100000000000000000000000000000000000000times.
One time Sadat had a plebicide of 98%, but later it was modified to 98.5%
Otherwise it is 99%.
Up until the last elections, there was only one name on the ballot.
Change is always possible in Egypt, but not by election.
I'm not harsh. I state the facts.
THERE ARE NO PRESIDENTIAL ELECTIONS IN EGYPT.
with the incredible amount of religious extremism (both in Christian and Muslim Egyptians: and I'm not saying this out of any kind of dispicable political correctness, I'm stating a fact, and whether christian hatred and extremism was caused and is fueled by muslim hatred and extremism, is not the question at hand, and doesn't change the situation, but only makes it worse)
with the fear that many have,
I don't believe Egypt is ready for a democracy, in the sense that the people should choose who rules them, because with all that I have mentioned, the result of democratic elections might be the end of any hope for a future true democracy in Egypt...
I cannot say there are any strong enough candidates who can stand against the regime.. I do like some of El Baradei's points of view, and I respect him, but he doesn't stand a chance in my opinion...
Gamal Mubarak is very educated and knowledgeble as Marenhos Epchoic mentioned, yet we have no reason to believe he won't continue his fathers legacy by encouraging corruption and theft by government and friends...
so basically the choices are :
corruption and continuation of bad government OR extremistic islamic corruption and continuation of bad government...
I certainly oppose the idea of voting for a Copt, merely because he is a Copt...
in any case what Egypt needs is:
GOOD EDUCATION FIRST AND FOREMOST (because without it, all the rest is not going to happen)
GOOD HEALTHCARE
JOBS
AFFORDABLE FOOD
AN END TO CORRUPTION
it's a good thing we do not depend on the leaders of this world..
may God be with us, Egyptians...
You are kidding. I hope you are not even remotely serious.
There are no Presidential Elections in Egypt.
Mubarak will win with 99% of the vote.
There are no Presidential Elections in Egypt.
Mubarak will win with 99% of the vote.
No President in Egypt has won with less than 95% of the vote.
There are no Presidential Elections in Egypt.
The Presidency of Egypt is a modified monarchy.
Are you saying that there are no presidential elections in Egypt?
On numerous occasions enemies of the COC have been trying to use this false statement in order to discredit and attack HH Pope Shenouda III and the Coptic Orthodox Church to no avail. Furthermore it has been clear to everybody everywhere that the Orthodox Christians of Egypt under the spiritual leadership of HH Pope Shenouda III have been and will always remain very loyal and loving toward all the citizens of their beloved country Egypt.
Christians in Egypt do not have hatred or extremism they have only love, which is the core of Christianity because God is Love.
Isaiah 19:25
The LORD Almighty will bless them, saying, "Blessed be Egypt my people ...
As of the requirements for improvement I do agree with these points that Egypt need to address them more effectively, likewise any striving developing countries.
GBU
I hope you do not make such serious accusations (like calling someone officially a liar) without first thinking about what you say, I myself am not really bothered by it, you have proved in your last post your inability to form a deep and balanced argumetation, rendering your opinion of no value to me..
why did you change ur name to abu maqawma??? what does that even mean??
Maqwma = the Resistance
Abu = Father of
Also on this Topic, Egypt itself wants democracy but the thing is it is impossible to have democracy with Islamic fanatics running around the country.. if there were true elections in Egypt it would be like Gaza.. The Muslim brotherhood would win because people just see the Word Islam and vote for anyone running with that name; even if they were ignorant.
[quote author=deaconwannaB link=topic=9930.msg121597#msg121597 date=1288550273]
why did you change ur name to abu maqawma??? what does that even mean??
Maqwma = the Resistance
Abu = Father of
Also on this Topic, Egypt itself wants democracy but the thing is it is impossible to have democracy with Islamic fanatics running around the country.. if there were true elections in Egypt it would be like Gaza.. The Muslim brotherhood would win because people just see the Word Islam and vote for anyone running with that name; even if they were ignorant.
Yes your translation of my username is correct and for deaconwannaB I though it best not to use my real name online.
Pharaoh714,
I agree that the majority of Egyptians were able to vote in a new president it would most likely be someone from the Muslim Brotherhood or a related individual. However, as a Copt or even as a Egyptian Christian are there any candidates, whether Muslim or Christian, who you think would be better than the Mubarak family?
I noticed your previous forum name was God is love, this didn't surprise me.
I apologize to you as a brother, I sincerely want to reconcile with you.
I'd kiss your forehead as our local custom symbolic gesture of peace and true apology.
Your statement had affected me as a severe blow but I realized I shouldn't have been impolite toward you in such a personal way at all. Please accept my apology.
BTW I did not say that you said anything bad about HH the Pope, what I meant is that this argument is lately used (along with a bunch of other arguments) as a strong reason justifying and inciting the attacks against the COC.
As a side note I was much shocked today by this news:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-11575773
'Jesus had HIV' sermon?! How can this be possibly theologically true as they claim?
Jesus suffered the pain and the death of sin without sinning. He healed the lepers without being Himself leprous, healed the blind without being Himself blind - so how can a blind safely lead the way of another blind? It reminded me clearly that as humans our wisdom is limited and relative and that even long time pastors fall into serious errors.
The only way is to follow Christ's teaching to the end, to rely mainly on His continuous support by prayers and stay vigilant to avoid errors.
Having met people who are angry is their temporary first natural human reaction. Some people, not the majority fortunately, react instinctively to tribulations or accusations in spontaneous anger (which proved difficult to avoid). The more the problem is serious and generalized the more it touches more people, the more the anger. As Christians while being jealous in our faith (without fanaticism) we have to absorb and damp our frustrations and calm our anger, even when injustice continues: it's our way and our first commandment. This does not hinder us to seek for justice or to peacefully express our needs.
Yet few people may let their anger reactions persist more because they have lost hope for any improvement of their situation and this is a bad habit. What I want to say is if your personal experience had convinced you that these anger reactions are a general behavior in fact they are not so, and these very rarely amplify to become irreversible. They are mainly vocal reactions.
My position is still that this is not a fact at all because it does not fit to the main body of the CO Church and that those continually angry few will eventually be calmer, though caution may stay longer, which is a much wiser alternative solution for them.
Christians have also the duty to obey their leaders while standing firm in keeping their faith (not to lose it or yield it even during difficult times).
GBU
your apology is appreciated and accepted.
I wish to clarify, I too have been angered by what has been happening in Egypt lately concerning the Church and HH. It reminds me of the time when HH cried during one of his meetings with the people while saying: "In my heart there are many words I'd like to say, in my mind, even more, but I shall stay silent. I shall keep my silence so that God can speak."
when I changed my forum name it was because I realized what an impact the verse: 'and the truth shall set you free' really can have, if only one is able and willing to accept the truth
You said yourself in your previous post that no matter how experienced we may be, our wisdom is limited and relative. It is thus necessary to always self-relativate, in the sence that we should look at the beam in our eyes before we think of critizising others.
I felt your comment is one of: 'Not us, we do not make mistakes, we do not fall into the sin of hatred and anger like others.' This comes over as self-righteousness. (I appreciate your zeal for our Church, but I'm only stating how I interpreted your words, not how you necessarily meant them) Even if some muslims use this to justify their horrific acts against us, instead of completely denying what in my eyes has some truth to it (since there are sadly christian people who foster hatred in their hearts and have extremistic views, they may be a minority thankfully, but they are still htere) and evaluate our mistakes and see it as a chance to grow. We must always remain humble and be able to admit our mistakes..
About Christ having had HIV, I would just like to point out, without condoning this saying, that HIV is not to be linked with sexual promiscuity necessarily, some people get HIV/Aids accidentally (bad blood transfusion, needle that wasn't clean) and some are born with it; both of which have no fault in getting the deacease.. I think it is vital to always keep that in mind..
However, although I would never say such a thing, I understand where the pastor is coming from, I believe the essence of Christianity is the communion that the Church has with its Saviour, in the sence that Christ shared our humanity, the same humanity we all have (apart from sin), and we strive to unite with Him, making us connected to our God, rendering Him near to us.
In that sence, we may find solice in tribulations, knowing that Christ conquered the world, and that IN HIM we can do the same..
Of course, whatever pain Christ went through, it wasn't something He deserved in any way, while in our case many times our pain can be a direct result of our sinful actions.. and this is where one has to be careful... But I am no theologian, and in this case, I clearly say, this is merely an opinion and I stand corrected.
God bless you too
Thank you so much for your kindness.
Let us all join daily in prayers to Our Lord Jesus Christ for the safety of our COC and HH Pope Shenouda III. May He expose the evil plans against us everywhere and protect us all. Amen.
GBU