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What do you do when someone is rude?
Hi,
What is the Christian way of behaviour if someone is rude towards you? or says something insulting to you? or if that person jokes with you in a rude way?
Naturally, you could get angry - which is understandable, and perhaps you don't have to be rude back... but is that Christian?
I must admit, I found the way the stars responded to Ricky Gervais's jokes and sarcasm extremely well done. Their response was so polite, yet they didn't falter. Did you find this also?
Are you, as a Christian, meant to take insults, turn the other cheek, or what?
Is it wrong also to shout at someone if they are rude to you?? Does one have a right to be angry??
What is the Christian way of behaviour if someone is rude towards you? or says something insulting to you? or if that person jokes with you in a rude way?
Naturally, you could get angry - which is understandable, and perhaps you don't have to be rude back... but is that Christian?
I must admit, I found the way the stars responded to Ricky Gervais's jokes and sarcasm extremely well done. Their response was so polite, yet they didn't falter. Did you find this also?
Are you, as a Christian, meant to take insults, turn the other cheek, or what?
Is it wrong also to shout at someone if they are rude to you?? Does one have a right to be angry??
Comments
Ephesians 4:26-27
26 Be angry, and do not sin: do not let the sun go down on your wrath,
27 nor give place to the devil.
....
31 Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamor, and evil speaking be put away from you, with all malice.
32 And be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God in Christ forgave you.
GBU
May God help us to follow St Paul's teaching:
Ephesians 4:26-27
26 Be angry, and do not sin: do not let the sun go down on your wrath,
27 nor give place to the devil.
....
31 Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamor, and evil speaking be put away from you, with all malice.
32 And be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God in Christ forgave you.
GBU
Excellent quote.
That's good to know. So we can be angry.
If this "anger" manifests itself by raising of the voice and demanding an apology - is that "rude"?
I think it is rude if it involves swearing, or being offensive back.
That's why I was EXTREMELY impressed with the stars/actors etc who responded to Rick Gervais. I found the way they responded was peaceful, yet to the point. In fact, I can see why they are stars. Tom Hanks was just fantastic.
GBU
They are nobody important. They are famous for being famous for being on TV.
The real stars are unknown, are engaged in humble service.
The current craze for celebrity, which even infects the Church, is like a false religion. I have no interest in the opinions of any TV or film actor on any matter other than perhaps acting.
Father Peter
You never answered me about the Skype name. You're a real star (not in correspondence to TV celebrities). Can your fans (us, tasbeha members) be apart of your buddy list? :)
I am not sure what you mean by 'they are stars'?
They are nobody important. They are famous for being famous for being on TV.
The real stars are unknown, are engaged in humble service.
The current craze for celebrity, which even infects the Church, is like a false religion. I have no interest in the opinions of any TV or film actor on any matter other than perhaps acting.
Father Peter
I mean they are talented. That's not a bad thing. How do you know even what their private lives are like? I found the way that they responded to someone who was rude to them very charming indeed.
Also, I think T. Hanks is a talented actor at the same time. Its a talent.
I'm not at all crazy about them, nor interested in their personal lives - I'm just saying that I found how they responded to someone rude, in a brilliant, off-the-cuff way, very smart indeed. Its very quick thinking.
Father Peter,
You never answered me about the Skype name. You're a real star (not in correspondence to TV celebrities). Can your fans (us, tasbeha members) be apart of your buddy list? :)
I hate how people magnify priests, and make them into "stars". If they were humble, they wouldn't care for such comments. But its interesting how you give it to a priest.
For me personally, if I could turn back time, I'd have made sure the ones I knew were in jail. Unfortunately, they are dead.
Another day when a council was being held in Scetis, the Fathers treated Moses with contempt in order to test him, saying, "Why does this black man come among us?" When he heard this he kept silence. When the council was dismissed,they said to him, "Abba, did that not grieve you at all?" He said to them "I was grieved, but I kept silence."
I think the Coptic Orthodox Church applied and lived by this principal for a long time. In fact, I'd like to paraphrase H.G. Bishop Souriel:
"We have kept silent too long, and have suffered as a consequence. Enough is Enough! We demand equal rights".
In fact, this silence you speak of, Anba Pola, may have caused the lives of Coptic Christians had they followed it.
TITL, I would gladly make my Skype name widely known, but I have so little time. I am certainly not a star in any sense. But I have to work hard most days at my day job, as well as fit in all the service God has been pleased to give me, unworthy thought I am. There never seems enough time. But I have to believe that God gives enough time for all those things he wills us to do.
If my circumstances change as God wills then I will gladly speak to all who want to have a conversation with me.
God bless you
Father Peter
Zoxasi, Lol! I don't think that you are crazy about celebrities, but it seems the whole world is.
really? In the Church also? I didnt get this impression.
I couldn't really care less about them. I was just watching the news as Ricky Gervais (whoever he is) made some rude jokes about them. I was just impressed, as I said, at how eloquently and civilized they responded to him.
I think that at least is a good example.
Father Peter, you are a star. Don't listen to Thoxsasi. He is just upset that he's not a priest.
I just took a look at who's online and found 9 people (aka bots) viewing my profile. I'm a star. What's the big deal in making a priest a star? They resemble what is pure and holy, not what is thin and good looking. We look up to them. We imitate them. We learn how to live our lives from them. They are stars.
Father Peter, you are a star. Don't listen to Thoxsasi. He is just upset that he's not a priest.
Titl,
Seriously, Priests have an ENORMOUS amount of struggle in their lives. Its not an easy job. Its EXTREMELY hard. Giving them such praise does not help.
Let me tell u why:
I know some priests very well, and one priest, in particular is VERY virtuous (IMHO). Copts speak amongst themselves and say to themselves at how "holy" this particular priest is. Fair enough. Then it gets to the point that they want to have Holy Communion from him BECAUSE its a blessing to take it from hands of a man that is "holy".
I really don't like this attitude. Its dangerous.
Whether a priest is holy or not, its not for us to judge. If he IS holy - then its his job. Copts tend to raise / deify priests also to the point that they want to see someone better than them. They TOO should be Holy.
A lot take the Communion as the REAL Body of Christ that they should partake of SIMPLY because the priest who is doing the service is "holy" in their eyes.
So, what if a priest is NOT holy in their eyes? Does that mean that this is not the real Body of Christ on the altar? Does it mean that his baptisms and all sacraments that he performs are invalid?? NOT AT ALL!!!
That's what's so worrying.
We are indeed a Church of sacraments and we need priests to execute these sacraments. If we lived each day with such behaviour as treating priests as stars, or "super holy" men (which, I'm sure they are), we unwittingly end up glorifying a priest and not God. This happens time and time again.
Then there becomes jealousy.
Look, i'm not going to speak from my own words, but even quote for you something from the Bible:
In 1 Corinthians 1:14, Saint Paul sees that some people have become followers of certain disciples. He says something rather brilliant:
"I DID NOT BAPTISE YOU IN MY NAME".
We deify priests SO much by this attitude ya TITL that you exhibit, that you fall into the same problem Saint Paul was drawing our attention to:
A priest is simply a tool. Its ultimately the Holy Spirit that works through Him that we worship. Not the priest.
I respect priesthood tremendously. Whether the priest is good or bad. THat's NONE of my business. It should be none of anyone's business.
Some celebrities insist on using vulgar language and manners, others have style, others took special VIP or diplomatic protocol courses. Most of them are actors interested in keeping a certain image of them alive in the minds of their audience. The whole TV session's script could well be mutually arranged in advance, live ones included, though it's good to evaluate what's good as a good thing - but that's not necessarily the whole story.
Actors are... acting.
GBU
Everyone like sometime in life to have a famous person as the ideal achievement example to reach. Without guidance it can be anybody whether good or bad: unfortunately many front cover deceptive celebrities (the stars) fall in this category.
Some celebrities insist on using vulgar language and manners, others have style, others took special VIP or diplomatic protocol courses. Most of them are actors interested in keeping a certain image of them alive in the minds of their audience. The whole TV session's script could well be mutually arranged in advance, live ones included, though it's good to evaluate what's good as a good thing - but that's not necessarily the whole story.
Actors are... acting.
GBU
I just appreciated the WAY they answered someone who was rude towards them. Whilst they are "off-set" , they are not acting. If they were acting, then they did very well.
They were really insulted, and responded with a lot of class. I love that.. even if they were acting. There's a lot to learn from that.
They didn't respond in a vulgar way at all.
We should all have Christ as our role model.. not a priest. Really! IT IS DANGEROUS to have a priest as a role model. He should be also striving, like us, to have Christ as his role model... otherwise we are simply admiring personalities. I HATE THAT!!
I remember even, in one particular church, there was jealousy between priests over this. One was taking "more confessions" than the other. lol. WHO CARES?? I don't know.. but they used to even argue about it.
I think its wrong to have ANYONE as a role model other than Christ.
When saint Paul says "I am the chief of sinners" - we also say the same words as him during the prayers of the Agpeya. When we say "I am the chief of sinners", am I comparing myself to my neighbour or to Christ?
I am comparing myself to Christ. Whenever I compare myself to Christ, I will always think that I am the "chief of sinners".
We ought to compare ourselves daily with Christ.. not with a priest, not with a man, not with a movie star neither.
Christ asked us to compare ourselves to Him: "Learn from Me, for I am Meek".
What's interesting is this: These actors/movie stars, may not know Christ, but they behaved in a very descent way when insulted. I must admit that. This is very good. I'm not looking up to them, but I loved how they didn't return evil with evil.
GBU
Zoxsasi,
The sermon on the mount is very clear. Go read it :) Christ said specifically "turn the other cheek"
I think everyone has misunderstood this "turn the other cheek" saying. I thought it meant to offer the other cheek when the 1st one was slapped. But that's apparently not what it means at all. I still don't know what it means. But it definately doesn't mean one has to be subjected to rudeness and unfairness and offer himself to be treated like that again!!
I just wanted to know whether it was OK to raise one's voice when someone insults you? I think JOHN S200 answered it:
Ephesians 4:26-27
26 Be angry, and do not sin: do not let the sun go down on your wrath,
27 nor give place to the devil.
....
31 Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamor, and evil speaking be put away from you, with all malice.
32 And be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God in Christ forgave you.
------------------
I guess its OK then to raise your voice SO LONG as you don't sin.
THanks
Second, I'm still not convinced that we shouldn't look to priests as stars. What's wrong with saying "I like this priest because he's very knowledgeable in church theology" or "I like this priest because he has a good sense of humor and a nice voice" or "I like this priest because he added me on Skype"? It's showing partiality and affecting their humility-level, yes, but it's also showing a sense of love and encouragement. The way I see it in my head is that a loved, "famous" priest is more likely to continue and expand in his service than a priest who doesn't get much attention. Maybe it's psychology.
We all deal with pride in one way or another, for instance when I saw 9 people viewing my profile, I got a little puffed up (even though I knew they were bots and not real humans). You can't prevent people from sinning by limiting your actions.. well you can I guess, but the devil is still going to find a way. If it's not from people's praises then it's from evil thoughts. An example I can think of right now is when the Pope gives his sermon in the Alexandria Cathedral every Wednesday, how the people stand, clap, and zaghrat every time he finishes a sentence. Should the people stop because he might fall into the sin of pride? He's the Pope, even if we never ever encouraged him or showed him love, having prideful thoughts will still be a great temptation. Same with a priest. They're still going to be tempted without our words.
What I'm trying to say is, they can deal with the pride issues by the strength of God, but that shouldn't stop us from praising and encouraging them.
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/clamor
TITL,
Abbreviations Acronyms Dictionary
http://www.acronymfinder.com/
GBU
IMHO means: In My Holy Opinion, Is My Hearing Aid On, International Medical Health Organization, In My Humble Opinion, In My Highest Opinion.
I know which Thoxsasi meant: Is My Hearing Aid On.
To answer your question I, too, have an acronym for you: HDSISMNSBSLSHFDUESKMSHDNMSJHDU
I have no idea what u mean.
All I am telling you is that turning the other cheek DOES NOT mean allowing people to be rude to you.
IMHO = in my honest opinion.
John2000 - why do you talk about clamour?
Did I misunderstand your Bible quote?
A brother came to see Abba Macarius the Egyptian,
and said to him, 'Abba, give me a word, that I may be saved.'
So the old man said, 'Go to the cemetery and abuse the
dead.' The brother went there, abused them and threw stones
at them; then he returned and told the old man about it. The
latter said to him, 'Didn't they say anything to you?' He
replied, 'No.' The old man said, 'Go back tomorrow and
praise them.' So the brother went away and praised them,
calling them, 'Apostles, saints and righteous men.' He
returned to the old man and said to him, ‘ I have
complimented them’. And the old man said to him, 'Did they
not answer you?' The brother said no. The old man said to
him, 'You know how you insulted them and they did not
reply, and how you praised them and they did not speak; so
you too if you wish to be saved must do the same and
become a dead man. Like the dead, take no account of
either the scorn of men or their praises, and you can be
saved.'
[hr] Zoxasi,
when HG Bishop Souriel said what he did, I don't think he was referring to us being simply insulted, but rather the situation in Egypt where it goes far beyond insults day after day. I only thought of the quotation in the aspect of someone being rude to us personally. I can choose to accept rudeness personally, but that doesn't mean I should leave my brothers in Egypt to be discriminated upon.
Saint Paul was arrested and put in prison for healing a woman who was possessed.
The fact that he healed her meant that her masters were losing income (because they made money from her condition).
Anyway, they quietly freed Saint Paul from prison - I think out of fear for some reason.
Saint Paul tells them: "No! I demand an apology! You put me in prison and accused me openly, and now you let me go quietly!!"
He demanded justice! He didnt go quietly at all.
We have rights!!
We insulted God's house by making it into a market...and selling stuff there...Christ, if I remember correctly, got angry and even demolished it. Why didnt He turn the other cheek if He was insulted???
Because you've misunderstood "Turn the other cheek"
The law spoken by Moses to them in ancient times enacted like for like: and while it forbade doing any wrong, it by no means commanded those who had already been injured to bear patiently, as the Gospel law requires.
For it says, "Thou shalt not kill: thou shalt not steal: thou shalt not forswear thyself." But to this is added, "Eye for eye, hand for hand, foot for foot, wound for wound, bruise for bruise." Such an enactment required a man not to injure others; and supposing him to have sustained an injury, that his anger at the wrong doer must not go beyond an equal retribution.
But the general bearing of the legal mode of life was by no means pleasing to God; it was given to those in ancient times as a schoolmaster, accustoming them by little and little to a better righteousness, and leading them on gently to the possession of the perfect good.
For it is written, "To do what is just is the beginning of the good way:" but finally, all perfection is in Christ, and His precepts. "For to him that strikes you, He says, on the cheek, offer also the other." In this there is pointed out to us the pathway to the highest degree of patience. But He wills besides this, that we pay no regard to riches; so that even if a man have but one outer garment, he must not count it a thing unendurable to put off with it also his undergarment, if it so happen.
But this is a virtue possible only for a mind entirely turned away from covetousness: for "do not, He says, ask back whatever any one taketh away that is thine: but even give to every one that asketh of thee:" a proof indeed of love and willingness to be poor; and the compassionate man must necessarily also be ready to forgive, so as to shew friendly acts even to his enemies.
Not so that they feel proud, but so that they are strengthened and encouraged. Being a priest can be a very spiritually and personally exposed ministry.
Father Peter